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ravensmoon666 (ravensmoon666) wrote in artists_beware, @ 2018-12-31 16:40 Artist Beware: Underthedarkness WHO: Underthedarkness WHERE: Furaffinity, Toyhouse, Trello. WHAT: A 40$ full body flat and a 90$ YCH. WHEN: 05/01/2018 for the flat colours and 05/19/2018 for the YCH until the current date. EXPLAIN: I will say in advanced I do not have as much proof of all of this as I'd like, we used to talk over notes for previous commissions but after she invited me to her Discord server we talked over Discord DM's. I never had her added as a friend on there since I could just DM her because I was in her server. While this was going on I had closed our DM conversation by accident as I close ones I am not currently using and only found out about her jumping ship after I went to message her and noticed she removed me from her server (or just deleted it all together.) I cannot open our DM's unless she is a friend or I know her ID which I do not. Everything below is mostly written from memory with rough date estimates. I used to commission Under a lot and didn't have that many issues outside of her being very slow with commissions (From personal experience and dates I had noticed on her public Trello from other people commissioning her). Recently I had commissioned her for a reference of my persona and she did a really amazing job (I did end up paying her extra money to rush it though as I wanted it done soon) so when I saw she was steadily posting journals talking about how she was desperate for money and opening for emergency commissions I felt bad and had messaged her asking her if I could commission her to do a dragon-taur rendition of my persona. She said she had never drawn one before but she could try. I told her that if it was too hard for her and she ended up not liking it she could scrap it and chose another one of my characters to draw instead. She agreed, I linked her my characters to chose from if stuff went wrong and we exchanged details. She had been posting a lot of journals still talking about how she needed money and posting YCH's. She was having a hard time selling this one YCH commission I liked a lot but I didn't have the money for. She had reduced it from 100 down to 80 before removing it later, and I ended up messaging her to ask if it sold. She told me no that she didn't think anyone was interested so she just removed her. I asked her if she could hold it till next pay period and she agreed. She told me I could either pay the reduced price or more but it was my choice and I met her in the middle and sent 90$ About a month later she gives me an extremely rough sketch (basically just the body roughly sketched and the top half being the anatomy skeleton shapes) I approved it and she went quiet. I didn't hear much from her but kept an eye on her journals. She majorly had journals over the next few months talking about breaking up with her ex, losing her job, getting a new job, family problems etc. She kept taking on more commissions, even doing in-stream ones and not really working on her others. Sometime in October I noticed the chargeback date was coming close and given her history with being slow on commissions and noticing how bad she "needed money" I was worried that she wouldn't get my commission done for a while and messaged her telling her I was sorry and I felt like an asshole but that I had to put my foot down despite knowing everything she was going through but I was going to be needed a refund. She messaged me telling me that she understood and that I wasn't an asshole but that since she had no money it would be a while, but if I gave her another month she would get the art done. I told her I loved her artwork and wouldn't mind waiting but if it went further than that I would have to go down the refund route, she said she understood and we went on. (My mistake as I should have started the dispute then) Occasionally she'd send me a message telling me she would work on my comm soon, and halfway through the time she started working on the YCH and sent me a sketch. It barely had any work added to it, basically just went over the already drawn outlines and reduced the characters breast size (something I had asked as my character is supposed to have small breast and the YCH by default had large ones) I approved it and she went silent once again. The date for a month had come and gone, I even gave her a few days longer just in case before I went to Paypal to open a case, I knew I was already too late for the first commission but thought I still had a day or two for the second one (I opened both anyways) and Paypal automatically declined them because of them being outside the date. I knew the only hope I'd get my money back was if I messaged her so I went and messaged her telling her I would need a refund. She said that she thought I would at least give her "till the end of the month" (when I asked for a refund the month before it was midway through the month, not at the end) and that she didn't have the funds but would give me a refund when she could. Not too soon later I saw she had uploaded a journal saying she would be refunding EVERYONE on her queue and that she was depressed and no longer felt like drawing so she felt this would be easier. She said she would be looking at how much she owed everyone and would post how much she owed everyone on a public list. She also started "spamming" her TH trying to sell her characters for refunds. A few days later she posted a journal stating that someone had forced chargebacked her and she was in the negative so refunds would take longer. Halfway through December, she sent me a message saying she would be able to give me at least a partial refund in January and I told her I was happy she was keeping me updated and thanked her. She had also moved her refund list to her profile info. 12/30/2018: I was going through my Discord servers and noticed that hers was no longer on my list. I had a sinking feeling and went to check her FA and sure enough, it's disabled. I tried all kinds of methods to try to find our closed chat to no avail, I remembered a user that used to be a friend of hers/ on the refund list so I decided to message them and see if they knew anything/ at least knew her Discord ID so I find our messages. 12/31/2018: I woke up to a message from the said friend and they said they were pretty sure she deleted her discord as it no longer showed them as friends anymore and that she wasn't answering her text but if they found out anything they'd let me know. Before I could respond they then sent me another one saying that Under had blocked them on everything, including Twitter and Instagram and that it was heartbreaking as they were best friends. So I'm pretty sure Under has completely jumped ship. (I have these notes still if screencaps are needed but since it was kinda personal I didn't feel comfortable/ thinking it would be allowed) I saw that her TH was still active so I left a shout telling her I was appalled and that I would be writing an AB/ trying to go through my bank. PROOF: Proof of payment: https://i.imgur.com/6bQZYYc.png Announcing refunds: https://i.imgur.com/1QIy2fH.png Chargeback journal: https://i.imgur.com/bN8Q3ZQ.png Refund list journal: https://i.imgur.com/AiG3nwi.png According to this she owes people in total (including me) at least 1,271$ I honestly somewhat wouldn't mind just having the art completed but in the end, I'd rather just have my money back and be done with it. I'm very upset with her and myself as I knew better than to let it go outside the chargeback date but I did it anyway. I'm thinking about contacting my bank to see if there is anything that can be done from other transactions I've had with her but even then it won't add up to the amount she owes me.

Dec. 17th, 2011 at 2:40 AM creamytea WHO: KawazuSlime WHERE: http://www.furaffinity.net/user/kawazuslime/ WHAT: A digital commission of a fully inked and colored three-paneled comic. WHEN: Dec 9, 2011 PROOF: No images beyond text, but textual content NSFW - mature fetish themed. http://img444.imageshack.us/img444/1787/commissionblurred.png EXPLAIN: The linked screenshot in the proof section includes the entire conversation regarding the commission in chronological order from start to finish, including the unimportant parts. Recap: I was initially approached via notes on FurAffinity from someone wanting a commission, NSFW fetish material. The conversation was taken to gmail. The commissioner kept offering to pay me extra or double and mentioned he...had another commission going, and asked me several times about doing other commissions, but continuously complained of not having enough money to pay me fully for my quoted work. I ended up doing a full-color, three-panel comic for $15 less than I originally quoted for a commission of just an uncolored sketch of a 4-paneled comic, so I feel this commissioner got a really good value for his money. Several times throughout the commission, he expressed that he was happy with the results, but continued to ask for minute changes which, up to a point, I was happy to do. Twice after I felt we both considered the commission closed, he asked for more changes to the finished product and at one point he also asked me for free art. I was in direct email communication for two days in a row, answering his emails within minutes of his sending them (evidenced by timestamps in the screenshot). His commission was started and fully finished within 4 days which I find to be an extremely fast turn-around time compared to how long most artists take and given the amount of changes he requested. When I went longer than 15 hours without answering one of his emails, he sent several messages to me through gmail and to FurAffinity insinuating that I was blowing him off, taking his extra $5, and behaving unprofessionally. After a few more exchanges and in less than 24 hours, the same picture had gone from "probably the best commission I've had done in years" to "I should have never commissioned you. I know now that it was a grand waste of time and money..." My personal skills that he had been so happy with before were also called into question in a retaliatory manner. I even did an extra edit for him at the end in good faith so that we could hopefully resolve the transaction smoothly which he threw back in my face, calling me inept. I feel I went above and beyond for this person and worked with him on every detail every step of the way, but he turned out to be fickle and extremely difficult to please. His words could easily crush someone with less fortitude. I have had possibly over a hundred commissions in the last 8 or 9 years and this is the first time I have ended a commission unhappily. UPDATE: I received a new email in my inbox over the holidays from this person: http://img684.imageshack.us/img684/5149/followup.png I am torn about responding. I feel if I respond and tell him no, he will lash out at me again even if I am polite, and if I don't respond at all, he will still lash out for ignoring him. I really do hate to ignore people, but I currently have no intentions of replying. I am posting this update solely to ensure this log remains complete.

Dec. 11th, 2011 at 5:43 PM ext_927176 WHO: Gideon, AKA Gideon Hoss.WHERE: http://www.furaffinity.net/user/gideon/WHAT: I had messaged and paid for a simple digital piece of a character of mine, sitting back to viewer, looking behind all cute like. The art had been paid for via paypal already.WHEN: The order was sent and paid for on august 8th of 2010. I messaged him on July 9th about the comissions, and he assured me it was due to con scheduling and the various online projects he was working on. After multiple contacts and it being almost two years later without a sketch or a word, I'm beyond fed up.PROOF: Paypal transaction, with personal info and transaction ID blacked: http://i794.photobucket.com/albums/yy228/bentokitty/gideon/Screenshotat2011-12-11171548.png message-by-message account of the request: http://s794.photobucket.com/albums/yy228/bentokitty/gideon/ORIGIONAL_REQUEST/ Conversatons with since, including re-submitting request via email and paypal transaction: http://s794.photobucket.com/albums/yy228/bentokitty/gideon/ EXPLAIN: I have attempted to contact Gideon multiple times via Furaffinity, and via the various IM clients he has given me (which he has not been on since giving said screennames to me). I have not had any contact with him since, no sketch, no progress, nothing. I just want the art I paid for, please. I'm dissapointed that it came to this, and took two dang years. UPDATE: As of 12.27.11, I have attempted to contact Gideon on FA, as per his request here. This report was the last contact between him and I. Come on, really? Mood updated from annoyed to PO'd.

Dec. 10th, 2011 at 2:09 PM pagan_foxcat The following was mostly written by Jaitsu on behalf of both of us. I'll put my own blurb at the bottom: "WHO: Vani/Vanimute/VanillaKitsune WHERE: http://www.furaffinity.net/user/vani WHAT: Was supposed to be a traditional art commission, in the style of http://www.furaffinity.net/view/4014996/ , for $65, split between myself ( Jaitsu / http://www.furaffinity.net/user/jaitsu ) and Neopagan ( http://www.furaffinity.net/user/neopagan ). WHEN: The commission was agreed upon and paid for at Anthrocon 2010 (so, mid-late June, 24th/25th?) July 27th she started posting journals going on about her life situations delaying commissions ( http://www.furaffinity.net/journal/1586921/ ). Since she seemed aware that she had commissions waiting, including ours, we waited to prod her with emails. When she finally replied, she said she'd have the commission done by JUNE, or give us a refund. We agreed. It's now long, long past June, and we've received neither, and she's no longer reading notes or responding to emails. (Her twitter's still pretty active, though, so you can't say she doesn't have internet access) PROOF: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/18095502/paganvaniemails.png EXPLAIN: See "when" for most explanation. We paid for the commission at AC '10, then gave her plenty of time to work on it... then she started putting up dramajournals, so we felt sorry for her and waited a while longer. She kept putting up journals pointing out that she was aware that there were commissions waiting, including specifically mentioning ours, so we continued to wait, until finally, we got impatient. Neo noted and emailed her again, and FINALLY got a response, offering to do our commission (now upgraded to digital) by June, or give us a refund. As of October 4th, we've received neither, and the last several notes we've sent her haven't even been read." Now, this has been sitting in my email ready to post here since mid October, but I've been hesitant to do so, maybe even a little guilty. I know what it's like to have real life throw bricks at you and the tons of other artists I commission know that I try to work with them and give them a lot of leeway(and tip frequently!) But, enough is enough. I've commissioned and had a full fursuit complete in a lot less time. After emailing her failed (which is apparently the BEST way to get in contact with her), I left her a note on FA which by it's bright yellow color has not been read since mid October, and it is now December. Due to the extensive list of people and any lack of reasonable progress on ANY of them, I'm sure there are many more people who are a little tired of waiting over a year for a simple piece of artwork that they paid good money for( http://dl.dropbox.com/u/18011580/don%27t%20take%20out%20of%20here/todolist.png ), I'm just the first to post about it here. A year and a half and nothing at all, infact, lost contact yet still twittering away? She doesn't seem like the dickish sort, but irresponsible is irresponsible. For those of you who would think me foolish for getting a commish from someone with that long a lineup, I actually didn't know the artist well and the first exposure to them was the dealer's den at AC 2010. It was only after I got home did I see the huge to-do list. What's worse, is that she started offering commissions for more money in between this and had friends pay her way to AC 2011 apparently.. ? I don't know if/when she is going to resurface. But if she does I want people to know her work ethic beforehand so they don't get into the same situation.

Dec. 6th, 2011 at 1:53 PM neolucky Sometimes when someone copies my work, they like to note me about it. Other times they only contact me after they were caught doing something wrong - In this case it's kind of both. After being caught, the artist in question comes to me, offers a kidney from his country and that he may have...used an image of mine. So I investigate. The user is: http://deserter-project.deviantart.com/ My original image: http://media.photobucket.com/image/starfire%20neolucky/NekoHybrid/Commission__Starfire_by_Neolucky.jpg Side by side: http://neolucky.com/dajournal/starfirecomparison.jpg His copy (rehosted as he removed it): http://neolucky.com/dajournal/commission_starfire_animecomic_by_deserter_project-d47mkql.jpg The trace: http://neolucky.com/dajournal/starfiretrace.jpg Comment in post: http://neolucky.com/dajournal/toldhimtoremove.jpg His note to me: http://neolucky.com/dajournal/kidneytrace.jpg His note entailed how he's trying to find me a kidney, and that he also used my art to make commissions. Then I happened upon his gallery and boy howdy, he's a professional tracer. Sooo yeah...probably going to be reporting a lot in this one. He's taking commissions and then outright tracing images without really understanding the legality of the matter. English most certainly isn't his first language, but I hope he understands why this is wrong. Normally I would just post him to art_theft and leave it at that, but a customer of mine bought art from him, and he's also trying to make money off of other peoples hard work =| so thats no bueno. If you spot any other traces, I'd love to have them to report with!

Dec. 2nd, 2011 at 9:59 PM jackrow WHO: Rainhopper / Toast Rabbit WHERE: Rainhopper OR at Toastrabbit WHAT: Not willing to pay commission price he owe me. WHEN: Ordered at 2009 July 25. - Picture received at approximately 2010 August. Payment haven't arrived ever since from him. PROOF and STORY: There were a commissioner, called Rainhopper, also known as Toastrabbit in his actual name. He once commissioned me for a highly detailed artwork which would cost him 60 Euro, which is approximately equal to 80 USD. We discussed every single detail together to its finest. The communications are held upon Furaffinity's notes and GMail's e-mailing systems sometimes when we had doubts about things. Times have passed, and I have to admit I've got some complications with school and whatnot during the time and it kept for about almost a year which I felt myself ashamed, but once I've got some free time to finish what I was about to tell to be finished, I finally did what I promised and sent the original high resolution picture to him via e-mail in hope to get paid but only a somewhat short but still a modest thank you e-mail has been received and nothing more. The picture I did with such effort can be found here now here (since either him or the mods have removed it - EDIT: 2011.dec.04.) Though the description says that Jako did it, it was my former account and as the account journal says I moved to the newest location, just in case if someone is in doubt if it's about me or an other person, I just told it right here. However I uploaded it to my Furaffinity gallery, I've entitled it with a NOT PAID tag right infront of the title, to keep it in mind both for him and for artists if he's about to spot you as an other victim of theft. I have been waiting for months then I was out of patience, thus I asked him what's going on with the money? He said he is having complications with paypal nevertheless he's broke and 2 the rantgryphon holds him, which I accepted as "oh well, shit happens, let's just wait some more then..." I was hoping he was about to get that arranged ,but yet another several of those months have passed (almost A YEAR) and still nothing. Then I've asked him the same, but in a bit impatient motivationful voice via e-mail, and he replied the same. THIS is going on for ONE and a HALF YEAR by now, and I'm seriously out of patience, not to mention he dare to attend at MidFur as a Guest of Honor. How can people sleep at night like these? Till he don't pay me off, this thread will remain for letting you know who is about to comission you, and if I were you: DON'T ACCEPT ANY FURTHER COMISSIONS FROM HIM(Toastrabbit, Rainhopper) as long as I'm unpaid. Hereby I'm going to link evidences with commentary. The screenshot cuts have datestamps to proove my complainment. Evidence01 A whole copy of what he sent me in notes by promising this and that right after arranging the details which looked nice and fair so far. Evidence01 supplemental Not so relevant, but the e-mail where I've sent the sketch for further detail arrangement to check if everything is alright with it. Normally I keep doing things this checking way, to avoid complications in details, wether my customers like the way it looks or not. Evidence02 Months have passed and still nothing... Evidence03 Right after I uploaded the picture, all he did is just a thank you, not even mentioning he' still willing to pay me or something which OUGHT to be happen after this long delay if I were him. Evidence04 Evidence05 What? He can even AFFORD to make it to MidFur from the United States?... Okay, where is my diamond shotgun? Evidence06 Perhaps this is another excuse not paying me out...

WHO: West, Westfalen. WHERE: Furaffinity, Inkbunny, Livestream WHAT: A chemisty / Periodic Table icon. WHEN: November 22, 2011 - November 26, 2011 PROOF: Paypal receipt (with West's real name hidden) - http://img42.imageshack.us/img42/269/reklawiconproofreceipt.png EXPLAIN: This really is nothing major, and in the end I'm just posting it as a warning to the community. On November 22 I commissioned West to do one of the Periodic Table icons he was advertising so heavily in places like FA and Teenycom. Communication went alright, and then suddenly last night (November 26) I'm noted about some chat logs that showed up on a public livestream while West was working on my icon. I'm putting it behind a cut because long chat log is long and has lots of crude and pretty offensive language. The bolded parts are done by me to highlight the more important bits. 9:57 PM: westfalen: because, for fucking fuck's sake, I've already done like, two of these, and this is fuckface number three to have the same goddamn character design 9:57 PM: westfalen: because it's soooo original 9:57 PM: westfalen: jesus fucking cockfucking christ 9:58 PM: westfalen: if this keeps up I am seriously just going to lay down line white lines of mockitude until these fucker snort them up and love it 9:58 PM: Defenbaugh: Wassup 9:58 PM: Defenbaugh: Besides wolf rascism ? 9:58 PM: Defenbaugh: err speciesism 9:58 PM: westfalen: I feel sorry for the mothers of these pathetic man-children for the shame they must feel for having borne these sad space-wasting wastes of space into the world 9:59 PM: westfalen: fuck you, generic grey fox with long black generic hair 9:59 PM: westfalen: fuckkkkkk 9:59 PM: westfalen: youuuuu 9:59 PM: RedApeGuy: Yikes!: lol 9:59 PM: westfalen: *pants* 9:59 PM: LinkinArt: haha 9:59 PM: westfalen: sorry. I go into rages sometimes. 9:59 PM: Defenbaugh: Must be a guy thing? ? 9:59 PM: westfalen: hi, Linkin! welcome to the stream! 10:00 PM: LinkinArt: thanks ? 10:00 PM: bostitch: livestream needs a screencap option: ? 10:00 PM: westfalen: it's people like this that are slowly making me hate the fandom 10:00 PM: Defenbaugh: Which? 10:00 PM: westfalen: this grey fox black-haired boring fucker right here 10:00 PM: RedApeGuy: People who's characters all look like copies of each other 10:00 PM: Defenbaugh: snicker 10:00 PM: LinkinArt: Hair on furries gets annoying 10:00 PM: westfalen: hate them so much 10:01 PM: Kardi: I like hair, when done well. ? 10:01 PM: westfalen: hate 10:01 PM: Defenbaugh: Well Im a blakc wolf.. no hair.. 10:01 PM: bostitch: But they are all beautiful and unique snowflakes! 10:01 PM: bostitch: Bwahahaha 10:01 PM: Defenbaugh: ..> 10:01 PM: Defenbaugh: >.> -cries- 10:01 PM: westfalen: it's like, jesus christ, assfucker, I bet you wear a fursuit and then dress up like Sephiroth when you go to cons, you fatfaced ugly bogfuck 10:01 PM: Kardi: But I do say... there we go. XD Then again, there's a whoole lotta blond haired blue eyed people. ? 10:01 PM: Defenbaugh: West has Rabies... 10:02 PM: Kardi: West is in the gee-my-cold-medicine is trumping me tonight mood. ? 10:02 PM: RedApeGuy: When I was thinking of my character, I thought, I can make a character that looks like me or one that takes elements of animals I like 10:02 PM: Defenbaugh: -gets the rifle- 10:02 PM: RedApeGuy: The thing about an animal that looks like me is that it would have to be a skinny red fox.: And there are like 1929209812903 of those 10:02 PM: Defenbaugh: AHAHAHAHAHAHA 10:02 PM: Kardi: *sniff* It's okay, pa,. I'll do it, he's my dog... 10:02 PM: Defenbaugh: -dies laughing- 10:03 PM: LinkinArt: haha 10:03 PM: westfalen: THATS WHAT I THINK OF YOUR LAMEASS CHARACTER, REKLAW 10:03 PM: RedApeGuy: Oh my god, I just looked up at the screen 10:03 PM: RedApeGuy: hahahahaha 10:03 PM: westfalen: I HOPE YOU LOSE YOUR SCROTUM IN THE WAR 10:03 PM: RedApeGuy: I was wondering why everyone was dying 10:03 PM: westfalen: *pants* 10:03 PM: Defenbaugh: -gives West some oxygen- 10:03 PM: Kardi: *eyes it* Sadly, I don't think THAT icon is allowed on FA. 10:03 PM: LinkinArt: I'm choking here dammit 10:03 PM: westfalen: sorry. Kinda losing my shit here tonite. 10:03 PM: Defenbaugh: Used to be 10:04 PM: westfalen: actually, you know what 10:04 PM: westfalen: watch me pull the dickest move imaginable .10:05 PM: Defenbaugh: LOl did you just copy paste one of the other wolves? 10:06 PM: Defenbaugh: You are heartless 10:06 PM: bostitch: man that was awesome ? 10:06 PM: Defenbaugh: Someone will notice 10:06 PM: Defenbaugh: and SAY OMG TRACER! 10:06 PM: Kardi: I notice... I think West is just being a smartass tonight. ? 10:06 PM: Defenbaugh: Apparently 10:06 PM: westfalen: I totally did that 10:06 PM: LinkinArt: Haha tracer of his own work 10:06 PM: westfalen: traced my own work, yep 10:06 PM: Defenbaugh: I endorse smartassedness 10:07 PM: RedApeGuy: Hahah, I wonder if anyone'll notice 10:07 PM: Defenbaugh: I wonder if I could get West to draw boobs in this mood 10:07 PM: westfalen: unimaginative shitfucking cockschlepping assmongering slapcunt 10:10 PM: RedApeGuy: Hopefully no more grey colored black haired wolves. 10:11 PM: Defenbaugh: How about black greyhaired colored wolves? 10:11 PM: RedApeGuy: What.... I... don't get it. 10:11 PM: Defenbaugh: Blakc wolves, with greyheadhair ? 10:12 PM: westfalen: let's rant shamelessly about BLACK WOLVES 10:12 PM: westfalen: WHO THE FUCK DO THEY THINK THEY ARE 10:12 PM: Defenbaugh: NOOOOO 10:12 PM: westfalen: BEING BLACK ALL THE TIME 10:12 PM: westfalen: AND WOLFY 10:12 PM: westfalen: AND BLACK WOLFING LIKE SOME KINDA BLACK WOLF 10:12 PM: Defenbaugh: -represents- 10:13 PM: LinkinArt: Is that racist against black wolves? 10:13 PM: westfalen: totally speciesist 10:13 PM: Defenbaugh: I got a little white wolf in me, and its squirming. 10:13 PM: Defenbaugh: -drum hits- 10:13 PM: RedApeGuy: =P 10:13 PM: westfalen: I think there's a cream for that, Deef. 10:13 PM: Defenbaugh: ? 10:14 PM: Defenbaugh: "I coul dbe more crass but Im scared of West 10:15 PM: westfalen: hahahha 10:15 PM: Grafsburg: Oh wow. 10:15 PM: westfalen: where the hell is Enydimon 10:15 PM: westfalen: I need to thank him profusely 10:15 PM: westfalen: for not shoving his character's bare junk in my face the second I click that link 10:16 PM: Defenbaugh: lul 10:16 PM: bostitch: Is that a maple leaf? 10:16 PM: westfalen: screw that, I'm going to email him and thank him profusely 10:16 PM: westfalen: that's totally a maple leaf 10:16 PM: Defenbaugh: Treasure trail 10:16 PM: Grafsburg: I actually kind of thought you were a decent artist West. But really? Re-using old art for something someone paid for? 10:16 PM: Grafsburg: That's pretty cold. 10:17 PM: westfalen: Grafs, you're a nice kid, but I know where you live 10:17 PM: Defenbaugh: lol 10:17 PM: Grafsburg: Yeah yeah yeah. 10:17 PM: Grafsburg: Whatever. 10:17 PM: Grafsburg: Hope you don't mind them finding out about this by the way. 10:18 PM: westfalen: go nuts, kid. I hope being a shameless tattle tale makes you feel better about yourself. Some timestamps are missing because these are bits and pieces of others' chatlogs. 10:18 PM: Earwig: haha what the fuck tacky shit am I hearing 10:18 PM: Grafsburg: Shameless? 10:18 PM: westfalen: what the, holy shit. ANOTHER GREY WOLF WITH BLACK HAIR 10:18 PM: westfalen: I'M GOING TO FUCKING VOMIT, SRSLY 10:19 PM: Defenbaugh: -pats West- ? 10:19 PM: Defenbaugh: With a gotee 10:19 PM: westfalen: who the fuck do I have to stab to make the hurting stop Earwig: Cil try to have some tact, it's not charming. Some people have doofy characters but you're going to hurt your reputation by being snotty/insulting westfalen: whoa, Sare! where'd you come from? Earwig: Internet westfalen: arite. So, whaddya want me to do, Sare? 10:19 PM: Earwig: S'fine to bitch but keeping it in IM etc is best. 10:20 PM: westfalen: s'what I'm doing 10:20 PM: Earwig: Ranting is something we all gotta do, but this is in a public stream where your customers/fans see it 10:21 PM: westfalen: oh right, difference between public stream and IM, gotcha 10:21 PM: Earwig: They're giving you money so returning a level of respect back to them is the right thing to do 10:21 PM: westfalen: fine, fine. I'll return his five dollars. 10:21 PM: Earwig: Sometimes it's hard as hell, but on something like a basic aesthetic choice it's crappy 10:21 PM: Earwig: I'd ask him first, since I'm not the customer 10:21 PM: Earwig: It's just personal opinion 10:22 PM: westfalen: I hope one day I meet this guy in person 10:22 PM: Earwig: Who? 10:22 PM: westfalen: so I can tell him personally how I feel 10:22 PM: westfalen: EXACTLY 10:22 PM: Earwig: Are you talking about the customer you're working for? 10:22 PM: Defenbaugh: I think West is givign them the money back. 10:22 PM: Earwig: But who is she giving money back to? Because the customer's not complaining so far as I know, so he doesn't want a refund I'd assume 10:23 PM: westfalen: so wait, what 10:23 PM: Earwig: I'm just giving my 2 cents re: business tact 10:23 PM: westfalen: are you friggin serious 10:23 PM: westfalen: you come in here just to lecture me? 10:23 PM: Defenbaugh: -whistles and wanders that a way- Its uncomfortable i here. 10:23 PM: Earwig: I sure did 10:23 PM: westfalen: I'll tolerate lecturing from my manager because I pay her, but srsly Sare, aren't you being hella presumptuous? 10:24 PM: westfalen: jesus! After I did you goddamn favour! 10:24 PM: Earwig: What favour? 10:24 PM: Earwig: The donation for the kitten? 10:24 PM: Earwig: That was amazingly kind of you 10:24 PM: westfalen: you'll stick up from stranger mcstrangeface and not for me? 10:24 PM: Kardi: Then here, have my lecture here in channel. ? You need to put it down tonight. 10:24 PM: Earwig: This is a different situation 10:24 PM: Kardi: I never EVER lecture you in public.. EVER. 10:24 PM: westfalen: christ in a hammock! 10:24 PM: Kardi: Sigh... 10:25 PM: Earwig: presumption is when I don't know information and I just assume shit, which yeah I never do. But I saw how you're acting and it's definitely not presumptuous to say you're being rude and tactless. 10:25 PM: Earwig: And like I said I totally understand the ranting thing, I do it too 10:25 PM: Earwig: But I do it in private and I try to be fair 10:25 PM: Earwig: If these people were being shitheads to you I could understand it but it's not their fault they have similar designs back to back 10:25 PM: Kardi: You are so hopped up on cold meds you're snarly and grumpy and just in a mood and a quarter. ? 10:26 PM: westfalen: actually no, I'm not on cold meds right now 10:26 PM: westfalen: clear as a goddamn bell 10:26 PM: Earwig: Insulting them because of a very simple aesthetic choice in a place they can see it is just really... I dunno. I'm honestly surprised 10:26 PM: Kardi: ... well, then, you're in a mood and quarter. And also, I hope the kitten's doing okay. ? 10:26 PM: westfalen: hahaha oh my god I can't believe I'm hearing this 10:26 PM: Earwig: Yep, kitten is in a really nice place now and taken care of well 10:26 PM: Kardi: Cool. ❤️ That makes me happy. ? 10:27 PM: Earwig: I dunno why you're talking like this in a public place. It's your own noose you're tying, that's fine. I can't tell you how to run your business or how to portray yourself online 10:27 PM: westfalen: look, you two girls have fun talking kittens, ok, I'm sure you both have great cat stories to exchange 10:27 PM: Earwig: Are you drunk? 10:27 PM: Earwig: Like is this how you normally act? I'm just trying to be chill and explain what the hell you sound like 10:27 PM: westfalen: I apologize for all present for having to put up with this bullshit, I'm outtski, kids. Peace on earth. So basically: West is tired of getting nothing but grey foxes with black hair to do icons of, and expresses this by making personal attacks against me and throwing personal insults at me as a person over a simple character design, in a public chat where absolutely anyone could see it. He even goes so far as to copy and paste another commissioner's icon to make minor edits to for mine with the intention of passing it off as fully-custom work like all of his other icons and just getting my character out of the way. My icon, next to the icon West copied from: http://img842.imageshack.us/img842/4103/reklawiconprooficons.jpg He took the icon he made for Escafanatic421, copied and pasted it, and made really minor edits to the character: Eyebrows, muzzle marking, and the clothing's removed. He also moved "my" character further out of the frame to try to make it either less obvious, or so he could do less work on it, or both. I'm not impressed. When he gets called out for doing it so publicly, he proceeds to throw a fit and then leaves the channel. To be fair, I did receive the full refund as shown in the receipt I linked- The message that came with it was a simple "I don't think I can do your character right now, sorry!" I haven't received any sort of apology from West for his behavior, but I think it's because he thinks I don't know what was said about me in the livestream. While the personal attacks and this sort of behavior don't bother me too much, I'm posting this for anybody who may be considering commissioning West to beware of personal attacks and less than professional behavior if your characters happen to go against their idea of 'imaginative' character design. --Edited the post to fix spacing, it was showing up as a weird block of text for me. Hopefully that's better! Update: 11/28/2011 After just happening to run into West on livestream, I have severe doubts that this will ever be resolved. No copy-pasting to be had. I recorded every snide remark with Fraps. http://youtu.be/SVtAx9Hdz2w And Kathy had no idea this was going on, so leave her alone. Please.

2:23 PM midnightwolf777 WHO: Sarcatsic. WHERE: http://www.furaffinity.net/user/sarcatsic/ WHAT: This is regarding four digital bust shot pics payed for back in feburary of 2011. Of these four pics only three were done until last month when the fourth pic was done. WHEN: This took place over a period of nine months, Starting January 21, 2011. PROOF: http://pics.livejournal.com/midnightwolf777/pic/00001fhy/g1 http://pics.livejournal.com/midnightwolf777/pic/000026yk/g1 http://pics.livejournal.com/midnightwolf777/pic/0000s33y/g1 http://pics.livejournal.com/midnightwolf777/pic/0000ra2w/g1 http://pics.livejournal.com/midnightwolf777/pic/00005cf4/g1 http://pics.livejournal.com/midnightwolf777/pic/00004796/g1 http://pics.livejournal.com/midnightwolf777/pic/000062h3/g1 http://pics.livejournal.com/midnightwolf777/pic/0000q542/g1 http://pics.livejournal.com/midnightwolf777/pic/0000phqq/g1 http://pics.livejournal.com/midnightwolf777/pic/00007cc0/g1 http://pics.livejournal.com/midnightwolf777/pic/00008q3s/g1 http://pics.livejournal.com/midnightwolf777/pic/00009sxa/g1 http://pics.livejournal.com/midnightwolf777/pic/0000af5s/g1 http://pics.livejournal.com/midnightwolf777/pic/0000bstp/g1 http://pics.livejournal.com/midnightwolf777/pic/0000cf5b/g1 http://pics.livejournal.com/midnightwolf777/pic/0000dygb/g1 http://pics.livejournal.com/midnightwolf777/pic/0000ezhr/g1 http://pics.livejournal.com/midnightwolf777/pic/0000ftd8/g1 http://pics.livejournal.com/midnightwolf777/pic/0000gqww/g1 http://pics.livejournal.com/midnightwolf777/pic/0000h606/g1 The Pics in Question: http://i962.photobucket.com/albums/ae103/c4tspajamas/firefoxflareon.png http://i962.photobucket.com/albums/ae103/c4tspajamas/firefoxglaceon-1.png http://i962.photobucket.com/albums/ae103/c4tspajamas/firefoxglaceon.png http://i962.photobucket.com/albums/ae103/c4tspajamas/firefoxumbreon.png http://i962.photobucket.com/albums/ae103/c4tspajamas/firefoxvaporeon.png http://i962.photobucket.com/albums/ae103/c4tspajamas/firefoxvaporeon-1.png EXPLAIN: Hello. My name is Electricfox777 on furaffinity.net The deal for the four pics by Sarcatsic were agreed upon on Jan. 21st and paid for on Feb. 5th as can be observed by the screenshot timeline I’ve posted above. After the first pic was completed on Feb. 16th, Ideas were given for the backgrounds of the second, third, and fourth pics. The second pic was proposed finished on March 30th and a small edit was requested added to the pic. The second and third pics were completed and delivered on April 2nd. After that I received no contact from Sarcatsic at all, despite sending her one note a month asking for an update on the final pic. She received and read my notes and comments but never answered me back. By July I was beginning to get a bit aggravated at being completely ignored so I left a shout on her page, as well as a comment in a journal she posted advertising commissions. Still no word came from Sarcatsic until October 9th where she claimed that the receipt she has only shows that I paid for three pics, so three was all she did. I was surprised that she replied at all, but to have such a blatant lie told annoyed me to no end. So I posted a screen shot of my own receipt, showing that I had paid her in full for all four pics, and told her that just because she “believed” me to have only paid for three pics, it doesn’t explain why I’ve been ignored all these months. She replies simply “That's not what mine say, but whatever, here. Take it.” Now in truth I could have left it alone there, but I did not like the pic I was given. As patient as I had been. I did not feel I deserved a half assed pic thrown at me to get me off of her case. But instead of complaining further, I ask for a simple edit. I asked that the eyes and grin of the shadow be added into the pic. She doesn’t respond, and after four days I send her a polite thank you for honoring the arrangement and doing the pic for me. But I also tell her that the wait and being ignored for months was unacceptable and that I’d be posting an A_B against her for these things. She responds with a spiteful note telling me how ungrateful and unprofessional a person and commissioner I am, how I never treated her with any respect, and how I asked for edit after edit to the pics she did for me. I’ll admit I am far from perfect, but you can decide for yourself whether her rant was warranted. The issue may be closed, but I leave this post to warn others who may commission her in the future what I had to go through, and by extension, what they may go through commissioning her. Thank you for reading. Have a nice day.

Nov. 12th, 2011 at 3:10 AM mosasakkine *Edited some wording as per mod request, and a couple more screenshots* Who: http://www.furaffinity.net/user/bunnynyn/ ; https://inkbunny.net/kibafuryo What: My version of the image in question is still on my page, and still contains all the drama he brought in, if you're so inclined to read through it. I just thought I'd give everyone a heads up about this guy. He won a pinup auction from me on November 9th, which was to be finished that same night. He first insists that we discuss the commission via messenger, which is against my policy for personal reasons. He claimed he wanted to be sure we were on the same page and that I got it perfect. I let him know that I've never had trouble following instructions through email, and his request was so simple (going so far as to send me a pose reference he wanted me to basically copy) there was no possible way for me to screw it up. I told him that if he really wanted, I could stream it for him. Which I did, and finished the piece in under three hours. He was pleased with it, so I then posted it to FA. My TOS states that by commissioning me, the commissioner is giving me the right to post the image where I like, and that they in turn have my permission to post the work on their own page, as long as they give me credit and post a link to my page. At around 7am EST on Nov 11, my significant other noticed on the front page of FA, that he had uploaded the piece. Only he had added huge black text with his "copyright" info, and a giant SAMPLE across the character. I was kind of annoyed about that, but since this was the first time I've ever had to deal with anybody altering a work I've done for them, I had not covered that situation in my TOS. But he also hadn't credited me in the description. So I made a polite comment requesting that he credit me and upload the unaltered image instead. He hid my comment. So I made another, telling him not to ignore me, and to please respect my wishes or remove the image from his page. I made a journal to state my displeasure, not once calling him by name. You can see that journal here: http://www.furaffinity.net/journal/2899677/ He removed the image from his page. Then he posted a journal about how nobody was allowed to post any artwork of his "copyrighted" character anymore, or he'd sue them, then posted the link to that journal on the submission in my gallery. Hilarity ensued. My submission (WARNING NSFW due to penor): http://www.furaffinity.net/view/6828416 What he did to it: http://rainbow-mouse.net/misc/bunnynyn/bunnynyn_kibafuryo.jpg His journal: http://www.furaffinity.net/journal/2900787/ He posted a ton of "threatening legal action" posts, even going so far as to copy/pasta some legal gibberish from a law site, as though he'd actually contacted a lawyer, and posted it both as a comment and as a private note. Our conversation went as follows: http://rainbow-mouse.net/misc/bunnynyn/bunnynyn1.jpg http://rainbow-mouse.net/misc/bunnynyn/bunnynyn2.jpg http://rainbow-mouse.net/misc/bunnynyn/bunnynyn3.jpg http://rainbow-mouse.net/misc/bunnynyn/bunnynyn4.jpg He chose not to reply to that last note from me. Instead, he went and edited his profile to say "DUE TO RECENT EVENTS WITH A FEW RETARDS ON HERE I HAVE MOVED TO ANOTHER SITE IF YOU REALLY WANT TO KNOW WHAT IT IS ASK THEN BUT NO LONGER GOING TO DEAL WITH THE DRAMA FEST THAT IS "FA"" I guessed Inkbunny, and wouldn't you know, it wasn't hard to find. He had again uploaded that same altered version, AGAIN without giving me credit. This time he had in the description about how he had to remove it from FA because I had a fit about him uploading it (without mentioning my name). I contacted IB support and had the image removed with no fuss. Seen here:http://rainbow-mouse.net/misc/bunnynyn/bunnynyn5.jpg I posted another journal here, still not naming names http://www.furaffinity.net/journal/2901363/ Please also be aware that I did not send anybody after them or encourage them to flame him, reply to his comments, or post on his journal. I avoided posting on his journal myself because I was not trying to incite anything. Again, the situation seems to be resolved for now, until he decides to post the image again, which I have revoked all rights to him being allowed to post anywhere due to his douchebaggery. If you happen to see the image in question uploaded anywhere with his copyright on it, please let me know, and report it if you can. I'm posting it here on A_B because some people have suggested I do so. I would suggest not taking work from this guy unless you like dealing with a childish whiner who will disrespect your art and then threaten you with legal action. Why: Not a clue! Added at Nov 12, 14:00 EST: This has now escalated to the point where he has posted a threatening shout on my FA page (which I have left there to make a point), and trying to reverse the charges on Paypal, which I hope to god they don't take his side, or I'll be on the phone with them. Commissions are my sole income. I don't screw around with this. He has also since nuked his FA account and all the comments he made on my submission, so you're really only seeing half the conversations now. I hope my notes screenshots suffice. Added on Nov 14, 14:14 EST: Some people have started accusing me of acting childish and immature in dealing with this, and that because of that, they think I will lose respect, watchers, and commissions. You are all entitled to your opinions of course, but please realize that in actuality, I have had many people come to me in comment and note and tell me that because of how I handled the situation, they WOULD commission me, so I am seeing the opposite results. I'm sorry if it looks like I have an attitude, but I can assure you that unless you plan to act as this commissioner did, you'd have very little, if any trouble commissioning me. I am very easygoing and friendly, and this is a very extreme case. Ask anybody else who has ever gotten work from me. And so I do not have to keep responding to the six hour thing (the wait between my comment on his submission and my first journal about respect): "Six hours after posting a comment on their page, may or may not have been enough time. My concept of time is skewed, given that my "days" don't end (I'm polyphasic), so what feels like days to me might actually only be six or seven hours because I've already "slept" two or three times. I concede that that I could have waited a little longer, but I honestly doubt it would have made any difference, as I'm pretty sure he hadn't read the journal before hiding the comment. I have no proof, but I gathered as much from the way he responded to me." But in the end, if you still don't like my attitude for whatever reason, enough that you think I warrant a beware of my own, by all means post a topic about me instead of shifting the blame around in this one, which is a totally warranted beware against the commissioner, and my reason for posting here. I can assure you that had not posted here, and if any of you who claim now that my attitude has put you off from commissioning me had been watching me prior to this but was somehow unaware of this situation, you either would have a) not commissioned me based on my general personality anyway b) commissioned me and had a fine experience, because I treat my commissioners with the respect they give me, and I am fairly certain you are all respectable to artists when buying artwork. So please. I absolutely get the picture that I come off as immature to some of you. That horse has been beaten, and unless my personal watchers/commissioners express displeasure with the way I conduct myself, then I will continue to conduct myself as I have been for the last decade of doing commissions, as it has not been hurting me.

Nov. 9th, 2011 at 7:14 PM seaweed_fma WHO: Tailbiteryena WHERE: This is the link to the head she was offering: http://fursuitauctions.livejournal.com/2218735.html WHAT: Fursuit head and tail, an Oshawott like character. WHEN: The "auction" began and ended on October 24th, 2011. PROOF: http://fursuitauctions.livejournal.com/2218735.html (same link as above) that is the post where she offered the head. I was the first one to take her up on the offer, so she closed the auction. That link included a post I made almost a week ago asking about a tracking number. I have sent her several private messages over LJ and have not gotten anything back. Some screenshots: That was the first message I sent them the first night they offered the head This is the one response I had from them and my response with my address (blocked out of course) Three messages I sent, 2 weeks ago, 1 week ago, and then tonight, trying to get some information on the head. The paypal screen that shows that I sent the 70 bucks, 50 for the head and tail and 20 for shipping (which I thought was way too much but I wasn't about to argue too much about it) EXPLAIN: Honestly there isn't too much to say. I spoke with the person the night that they offered the head, but I have not heard from them afterwards. I know they said that they were moving and that was why they wanted to money that night, so I sent them the money that night, because they wanted to send it before they moved. This is the first time I have posted here, so I hope that everything is correct here. I am not here to badmouth this person, I just want my head that I paid for, that is all...

Nov. 4th, 2011 at 6:15 PM orange04 WHO: Dipper WHERE: http://www.furaffinity.net/user/dipper WHAT: Tracing other peoples' work to use in commissions WHEN: Friday, November 04, 2011 PROOF:/ Example1... Mine: http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b215/friedmilk/yoruart.jpg Hers: http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b215/friedmilk/dippertrace1.jpg The overlay: http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b215/friedmilk/dipperoverlay.jpg Example2... Mine: http://i.imgur.com/22S7c.jpg Hers: http://i.imgur.com/KLR8Y.jpg The overlay: http://i.imgur.com/Jk6T0.jpg Example3... Someone's: http://i.imgur.com/au974.jpg/ Hers: http://www.furaffinity.net/view/6502794/ While she may have cited her reference in this pic, there's apparently been some controversy surrounding it. Rumor being, she never cited it until she was called out for tracing it. I've heard this from several people, but sadly I can't prove if it's true or not. ***UPDATE*** (Sat, Nov 5th, 2011) - Dipper has made a public apology on her FA account seen here: http://www.furaffinity.net/journal/2880360 And with that, I have accepted her apology for tracing my work. I believe she's learned from this whole experience and won't turn back to tracing or taking shortcuts again. Whether her apology really is legitimate or not, the important part is she won't be foolish enough to rip people off again, especially now that people are being weary and watchful over her gallery. I didn't mean for this thing to blow up as big as it did, but I felt it was my responsibility to bring all of this to everyone's attention. EXPLAIN: A concerned user had notified me of a commission Dipper had uploaded to FurAffinity. They said it looked like a trace of a livestream doodle I had done for a friend some time ago. I was skeptical until I saw the over-lay (shown in Example1). This is a screenshot of the full description she included in the submission: http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b215/friedmilk/gwiibear_commission.jpg Nowhere did she even credit me. After some word had spread about her trace, she was quick to delete every comment left on her FA account regarding this issue. Example 2 was presented by someone who read about the news of Dipper's tracing. Their comment was: "It got me wondering about my partner's unfinished commissions with her (of which the WIPs have been deleted now apparently?)" Her note to me, including my disappointed response: http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b215/friedmilk/dippernote1.jpg Her reply: http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b215/friedmilk/dippernote2.jpg ...Which I didn't even reply to, because I had no words. Her last note: http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b215/friedmilk/dippernote3.jpg She mentions an artist with an "N" name because, according to my husband, she had noted him explaining that she traced because her commissioner, gwiibear, specifically requested she copy one of the artist's drawings. She refused to do that, but I don't know what made me the exception. I will have screenshots of these notes as soon as my husband gets free time to upload them. All of this has made me feel rather stupid and gullible for taking part in one of Dipper's own charity auctions (Shaytalis paid her $100 for winning my slot, which is no small amount). I actually felt sorry for her. She seemed to be someone with the worst luck in the world, but at this point I no longer feel sorry for her about anything. If she's as emotionally flustered as she claims to be, she probably shouldn't be taking on commissions if it's affecting her business practices like this (unless her commissioners enjoy being lied to and ripped off). I had considered posting this to art_theft, but felt it more fitting to post here considering she's been doing this for commission money. Dipper is an artist I really liked until today. I may be more sore about this than others since it's my art she's been stealing, but what she's done is still rather messed up.

Oct. 16th, 2011 at 7:30 PM thaily WHO: Luvythicus WHERE: http://www.furaffinity.net/user/luvythicus/ or http://luvythicus.deviantart.com/ WHAT: Art trade, 3 bags of plushies and fur fabric for 1 drawing. WHEN: May 29 2010 Summary: - I offer free stuff, but first come first serve, in order to prevent other people from snatching up 3 trash bags worth of plushies and fur fabric, he offers to trade me art to hold on to them until he can get someone to pick the items up. I agree. - He receives the items and expresses his happiness with them. - He acknowledges multiple times that he owes me work. - Of a certain quality. - Yet he forgets about me 3 times. - Inundates me with angst and lies, such as not having a working computer when uploading digital work or saying he's too busy when uploading gift art. - Lies, i.e. about being threatened to swindle money out of his viewers. - Currently claims he no longer has the items and says I will never get the art he owes me. Once upon a time, I was cleaning up and decided to give away of a pile of plushies and a few meters of fur fabric. The plushies and fur were really nice so I thought some local furries might enjoy them, so rather than give them to a local thrift store like I usually do, I put up a "free to a good home, first come first serve" post here. Enter Luvythicus. He said he knew someone locally who could pick up a large portion of the fur and the plushies the next day, but that didn't work out. Afraid someone else might come for the items before he/his friends could he said "I know you said no reserving, but..." and offered to trade artwork in exchange for me holding on to 13 plushies and several meters of fur fabric. He used this and this image as a sample to show the quality of work he would give me. I agreed and at this point it became a trade; the items for art. June 5 2010 he received the items and let me know how happy he was with them. June 7 2010 I give him the information he needs to draw his half of the trade. The link I sent him was this one, which is fairly clear reference I think. He complains about the complexity, but if you give her clothes you only have to do the stripes on her face, so. *shrug* September 7 2010 I remind him of our agreement. September 22 2010 he forgot who I am. After clarification I send him the reference link again and he says "Imma doodle her today fer sure x3" November 2010 I leave a shout on his FA page (no screenshot as it had since scrolled off) and again, he forgot who I am. November 26 2010 I remind him again, send reference link for third time. Eventually, on November 28 2010, I get a sketch. You might notice a discrepancy between the quality of that and the quality he promised. I hemmed and hawed, already pretty fed up with having to wait half a year for even a preliminary and being inundated with false promises and angst whenever I ask him about it. But I confront him and tell him this is not the quality of work we agreed on. Same day, he agrees and says he'll draw more. which is followed by another note in which he explains, apologizes and promise to "draw something proper". That's the last I heard from him for months. In the meantime he has and continues to take commissions, ask people for ideas to draw, does a lottery, draws gifts, does trades and offers free art and draws numerous pictures of his character doing the horizontal mambo with other people's characters. I understand people having a hard time, and I understand that paying customers come first. But in this case, I have no clue as to what the hold up is supposed to be. If anything I thought the fact he was uploading work would mean he'd definitely get around to mine, but either he has a 1.5 year backlog or he's taken commissions AND trades after mine and just skipped over the work he owes me. March 5 2011, I send him a link to the original LJ post as a reminder, he says I am not a priority and can't even draw for himself. But uploads gift art 10 days later. April 19 2011 rolls around and I'm fed up. I send him a a deadline, provide me with a preliminary within a month or return the items because I don't think he should get something for breaking his promise. Because he lives on the other side of the country and both he and I have spotty transport at best (depending mostly on public, which costs an arm and a leg), I asked (mutual!) friends more local to him and with transport, if they'd be willing to drop by and pick up the items, so it'd be easy for Luvy to bow out of the trade. He responds by saying he feels threatened and anyway his computer is broken so unless I can teach him to draw out of thin air.. He then makes an FA journal about the fact he's being threatened. Notice how, after a year of admitting he promised to make me art of a certain quality and that he was definitely going to get 'round to it, he goes to saying how he just offered a sketch out of the kindness of his heart. At least he's being honest when he says "I don't care if you feel cheated or anything". My response, also explaining that it wasn't a threat because well, it wasn't. I figured that if it was a misunderstanding, he'd delete or at least amend the post. However, in response to my statement that I was not threatening him, he says that the post is just a warning for anyone else who might suddenly demand art from him. So he knew he was not being threatened, but the post is still there, without even amending the information he knew to be false and he got at least 50 dollars out of lying to his viewers! The obvious falsehood of his post also casts a new light on this one: Silly customers. And makes me wonder how many more people he might owe work to. ? I tell him that, while he claims to only be able to use the internet via his phone and not draw digitally, he had uploaded digital work. I'm not angry, I just want what he promised me. May 8 2011 he's suddenly all cutesy and pleasant again, and asks for my real life address for a "surprise". I am suspicious, and ask him for a phone pic of the traditional media doodles. I remember seeing it, but didn't save it, it was the corner of a piece of paper with some doodles. He said there was a second sheet but the cat puked on it or something. By this time I was getting pretty exasperated with and tired of this person. Can you tell? ? Notice how he asks for the character's personal info AFTER I send him the link for the fourth time. Said link has a full bio, which is part of the reason I didn't respond. The other being that unlike him, I was busy-busy (end of the semester, commissions etc.) and didn't feel like telling him about my hobbies. The link I gave him 4 times had plenty of information he needed for some doodles. Needless to say I didn't hear from him after. Sent a note today, asking for an update, he complains he had to wait 5 months for information he already had and apparently couldn't do a single headshot since and he lost the sketches he already had. Despite the fact that I carefully stored my items and they were fine when I gave them to him, the fur was suddenly "riddled with bugs" and he threw it away; good time to mention he claimed the fur was for his then-girlfriend and he just never gave it to her, even though they were still together for at least a month after receiving the fur. He claims to have given the plushies to charity which I sincerely doubt. Considering his track record of lying to me, I heavily suspect he's just trying to brush me off and get me to leave him alone because he supposedly doesn't have the items anymore. And I'm confident that he will never, ever live up to his promise, leaving his post to be forever unresolved. I would definitely recommend people never give him anything again, money or otherwise. Sure he seems to do some commissions and trades, but why chance it?

Oct. 2nd, 2011 at 11:45 PM mikastar Who: RejectedDreams Where: DeviantART, http://rejecteddreams.deviantart.com What: Traditional Art When: September 30, 2011 - Oct 2, 2011 Proof: In explanation. I must strongly caution anyone who receives an art request from RejectedDreams on DeviantART. He comes off all nice at first, but then turns around and belittles your work, changes his story around, and accuses you of scamming him. Here is my ordeal: I posted a journal stating that I was doing sketch commissions. In the past, it was understood that that meant pencil sketches, not cleaned up line work. Most people realize this when commissioning. Journal - http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a357/neko_83/proof1.jpg So I get a lovely note from RejectedDreams requesting a commission. I proceed to find out further info about his request. I also let him know my process, telling him that he may request changes to his image once I submit it to him, before the final image is complete. Note - http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a357/neko_83/proof2-1.jpg He thinks that's "cool." And even tells me to include the same type of tusks on his elephant that I had drawn on a previous piece in my gallery. Keep this in mind, because later on he tells me that's not what he wanted at all. http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a357/neko_83/proof3-1.jpg I send him a preview of what I sketched up http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a357/neko_83/Elephant_Sketch.jpg Then proceed to tell him that if he would like any changes, he may ask for them now. He is completely fine with the image and tells me to go ahead and clean it up. Cleaned up image - http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a357/neko_83/AchooElephant.jpg http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a357/neko_83/proof4.jpg I send him the cleaned up sketch as well as an extra drawing for being one of the first 5 ppl to note me for commissions. He is very unhappy with it and begins to ask why its not like some of the other commissions in my gallery, mind you those were digitally inked, line art commissions, not sketches, as I had specified in my journal. http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a357/neko_83/proof5.jpg I actually feel bad that he misunderstood the terms of our agreement and would like to rectify the situation, but before I can even reply to his note, he attacks me, claiming that I am scamming him. http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a357/neko_83/proof6.jpg When I do respond to him, in a very professional manner, he becomes even more verbally abusive. As for the "ton of details," he was never specific about them at all and never made any suggestions when I showed him the preliminary sketch. I even agreed to revise the drawing, but as you can see, he just blew past that with his ignorant ranting. http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a357/neko_83/proof7.jpg I then issued a refund and blocked him. There is no way I am going to do work for someone like that. I tried to be nice...I mean I'm pretty sure I addressed the issue in a very professional way. I have never had such an experience like that before. Please do not take requests or anything else from this person. He is rude, completely unprofessional, and immature. http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a357/neko_83/proof8.jpg I advise saving yourself a lot drama by avoiding this one altogether. 10/7/11 Edit: Just wanted to thank everyone who has commented for all their wonderful support and advice. I just recently found out about this community and am very happy that it exists!

Oct. 1st, 2011 at 1:29 AM marblestheskunk WHO: http://www.furaffinity.net/user/timitei/ WHERE: Furaffinity and LJ WHAT: A digital ref sheet WHEN: July PROOF: In explanation Well I saw Timitei's post in teeny com here: http://teenycom.livejournal.com/970882.html I followed it to their FA and commissioned them for 2 ref sheets, one of them was done in a timely mater but I still have yet to recieve the second one. I sent them the commission info in a journal which has since been deleted but here is a screenshot of when she said that she had lost my commission info and needed it again: She then did my ref sheet but still had not done the other one. She then deleted the journal with the info, and I guess forgot about my note describing the raccoon so I reminded her and gave her another description Time went by and she still has not done it, nor has she responded to ANY of my notes I've been sending her asking for my money back, they say on FA they are unread, here is the most recent one: She also posted this on august 31st, but has had a submission since then: This journal was put up out of the blue with no explanation of when she will be completing my commission, its only $5 but I still want a refund and feel that it is wrong and that shes probably doing this to others aswell, seeing the comments on teenycom.

Sep. 30th, 2011 at 6:51 AM coobiee Aye, hello there. I'm relatively new to all of this, including LJ, so please forgive me for any mistakes. I'm not really doing this for myself, but more for everyone who is still waiting and anyone who ever goes to do business with her. While her art is absolutely fantastic her business manners and time for getting things done is absolutely terrible. Though she is usually pretty good with giving refunds if you ask for them. WHO: Galagya, http://siedend.deviantart.com/ , http://galagya.deviantart.com/ WHERE: wolfhome forums/serenityisles forums WHAT: premade poses for the chats WHEN: September 9th of last year. PROOF: Since it's been so long I can no longer grab proof of me sending the payment for them also I didn't pay with paypal I paid with the chat's currency which is deltas. Although I did earn those through commissions so I guess it still counts? Here's the topic where everything is even all the screenshots are taken from there. EXPLAIN: September of last year she had posted a topic on Serenity which contained a presale of a premade wolf set she was working on. It was $25 Paypal/50 Deltas to preorder them all so I sent out the deltas for all of them because I'm a really big fan of her artwork. When she posted said topic there was a little preview of them already and she stated that they were just WIPs for now but she was getting close to being done with some of them. (screenshot) So I figured okay then it shouldn't be too long for them to be completely finished. Well that's where I and many people were wrong. March of this year she finally comments on her topic after not giving any of us any updates at all apologizing for not posting in so long and saying she had redone the poses. She asked us if we wanted to see them so far or if we wanted to wait and most people said they'd like to see a little sneak peak of the new ones. (screenshot) Well that never happened. More and more time went by with no more updates or even a preview of the newley redone poses. So someone finally sent her a PM on the forums asking for an updated and apparently she replied with this. That was on June 11th of this year. More time went buy and in August someone posted a comment saying they were keeping an eye on a topic she made over on wolfhome forums with premade sets. I decided I'd take a look into and to my surprise she had started another premade set without even finishing the one she started over on Serenity. (screenshot) On Augst 28th someone had posted what Galagya had said through a PM on a different forum. (screenshot) Later on that day the same person gave us an update for the 20th of August saying Galagya was going through a move and her family was visiting her. They also said that she was busy with making her own chat instead of working on all this owed artwork that people have already paid for. (screenshot) I figured that's okay, real life things pop up and can't be avoided so I just went about my way. On September 23rd, it had already been over a year since myself and many others paid for these poses, I seen on wolfhome forums that they were finally all moved into their new place and even had internet. I also seen a topic Galagya herself posted on wolfhome forums August 31st. Which can be seen here. More time passed and still nothing. Now back in April she made a topic on wolfhome forums selling puppies which people had to buy and then in a few weeks they were suppose to get the completed refs of the adult versions of those. By this time those people that had paid for those were starting to get a bit frustrated. Which I can understand, but that's a whole different story really. Lets just say out of all 10 of those people who paid $20.00 for a puppy have yet to see a single ref finished. Not even so much as a sketch. Anyways it's now September 30th she still hasn't completed the premade set. Not to mention she owes quiet a few peple things they've already paid for, but that isn't for me to get into. Many people have sent her emails and PMs reminding her about them and asking her about them and still nothing. No updates, no previews, no nothing. Now like I said she's generally good about refunds if you ask her for one, but sometimes she gets an attitude about it. No I don't have proof, just past experiences. This isn't really anything new for her since she's been this way for a really long time from what I've noticed. About a year or two back there were people who had been waiting 3 years for a commission. I'm not sure how that is now though I'm pretty sure she refunded everyone or something. But yeah if you ever go to commission her just beware of how long it could possibly take her and don't expect updates. She gives little to no updates. Her art is wonderful, but the wait and no updates isn't.

Sep. 22nd, 2011 at 10:54 PM scenceable I guess this post is mostly a warning against dealing with this person. However, if there's anything you can suggest that I can do at this point, I'd love to hear it! ? Who Kate Sjoberg, AmandaKathryn (Deviantart and ebay), RedWyvrenStudio (Etsy) Where Ongoing through ebay, etsy, and deviantart What Well she sells unicorn sculptures that run $100+, but my issue is regarding other parts of the transaction. I'm just going to copy paste what I wrote in my own journal. I've never posted in this community before so I apologize if I leave out any information. I'm not really sure what to do with this. The seller here is an artist who I've been a fan of for ages. (Kate Sjoberg, AmandaKathryn, RedWyvrenStudio) I bought a fairy from her in 2006, and then bought a few unicorns, and commissioned a pegasus at the end of 2008. With the commission, I found her communication a bit shaky, like she wouldn't respond to messages every time and that type of thing. My first issue was a mermaid I bought from her in early 2009, she started the bidding low and the auction ended low. She charged me $35 for shipping, and it ended up only costing $12. I messaged her 4 times over a few weeks to get the money back to no response, and after weeks (I guess after that 4th message) finally I go to paypal and see she has refunded me $14. No paypal note, no reply to my messages, no apology. And the difference in shipping was a decent chunk more than $14, but at least I got some back. So I didn't press the issue, and left positive feedback anyway. Now ship overcharges piss me off in general so after that I didn't buy from her for almost 2 years. (I should add, money and falling out of collecting contributed to this as well) Then in Novemeber 2010 I bought two large unicorns, one was $135 and one was $125. The description on all her auctions says the items come with a COA (certificate of authenticity) and they didn't. Also, one of the unicorn's bases was broken. I contacted her through etsy about the break and the COAs. At first she had great contact. And then... nothing. However, against my better judgement, I bought a unicorn in February 2011 from her, which was sold with a "new version" of her unicorn tutorial. Here's our entire conversation through etsy. So, I would like to point out here a few things. First of all, I never got a refund or any sort of money back due to the broken item. She never looked into the claim or got back to me on that (look at the dates on the messages) and I ended up fixing the base at cost to me. The pegs are really expensive and hard to find and I used my own. I would also like to point out that she doesn't apologize at all about an item arriving broken. A few others things... she didn't tell me beforehand that the COAs would be sent separately- I had to ask. The description says they come with COAs. Also, again, she never mentions before I pay that the tutorial would be shipped separately or that it would take time to complete. I knew that info through DeviantArt comments only. Also regarding her last message to me- the COAs were NOT in the box with Dream. I never got them. After messaging her on etsy and getting no response I gave up. I hate chasing people and figured, whatever, let it go, just don't buy from her again. But it bothers me to this day every time I think about it. It's to a point where I want to sell them because I can't enjoy them properly due to these issues. The two unicorns I need COAs for I bought in November 2010. The unicorn that was supposed to come with a new version of the tutorial was purchased in February 2011. So recently, as in the end of August 2011, she posted on DA and I commented about something else and she responded. So I figured hey, she's around, I'm going to send her a note. Why not, might as well mend things if I can. Here are those. The following are messages through DeviantArt's note system So, I realize the tone in my first DA message was quite different from that last one. But that's it. Not only am I done with buying items from her, I am spreading this to others too. Again, I would like to point out that in the message I got from her in August, she did not apologize ONCE for a huge issue that is absolutely her fault. The thing is, they're PAPER. To appease me all she had to do was print two pieces of paper, sign them, slap the old tutorial on a disc, toss all 3 in an envelope and send them out! There is nothing hard about that. Ignoring messages and failing to do something so simple for your customers really just illustrates how little you care. And on a more personal note... I would also like to mention, because for those not familiar with the artist I think it's important- they're not cheap. I have 8 pieces by her that were $100-$200 each. (Sorry! I put this bit in for my LJ friends, I don't mean to mply that her work is overpriced or anything like that!)COAs and such might not seem like a big deal, but if I want to resell them at any point they're not worth much without the COA. As for the tutorial, she charges $13 for the old version and the price for the unicorn I got was started higher because it came with a tutorial. So I bought it largely because of the tutorial. So in many ways it's not that big a deal, not like never receiving an entire sculpture. However, in principal, I didn't receive what the description stated. In the end, I'm leaving this transaction feeling taken advantage of... it doesn't matter what business you're in, that's never something you want to do to your customers. ? If anyone has any advice on what to do, I'm all ears. At this point, I'm moving on and never dealing with this person again. It's really unfortunate that things have come to this because I'm honestly a big fan of her work.

Sep. 8th, 2011 at 8:06 PM thaily I hate writing these things, but I hate people using artists are doormats even more and even though this guy is local to me, he has internet so no-one's safe. It all started with a retweeted message that someone was looking for an artist in the area to design a mascot for a site and create 12 illustrations of said mascot for said site. The tweet came from the guy's intern but she's not the problem here so I won't mention her by name; I want to keep her out of this entirely, I've accidentally interned for people with how do I put this politely diminished moral judgment. I don't blame her, I only hope she doesn't pick up on his sordid (and I use the following word in the most liberal sense) business practices. But I digress, the company in question is called Tenno Media, Peter Bierhuizen is the person this post is about. He appears to be the owner and sole employee, save for the aforementioned unfortunate intern who has since left. The site the designs would be used for is fitness-ferdie.nl Because this happened locally, i.e. in the Netherlands, I will provide translations of our correspondence as well as screenshots for any Dutch speaking person to verify that the translations are accurate. I invited the tweeting intern to look at my site and mail me if she liked my work. First e-mail. "Sending you an e-mail following your tweet. I design websites as a side job and my boss has asked me to design a character. Simply: a frog in an orange shirt with FF on it. A reference to Fitness Ferdi, a web shop where people can buy fitness appliances and goods. Of Ferdi, the frog, he thinks he'll need 12 drawings (illustrations) that will be used in various ways (websites, flyers). I don't know what kind of budget is available. This would kind of depend on the amount of time the designs will take to make. Vaguely said, but if you think you can create Ferdi I would like to receive a message. Kind regards, X" First reply, I explain my process, how many hours I will need and how much I charge; minimum wage is about €9,20 for my age bracket. This will be relevant later. "Hello X, I can definitely design a fitness frog. My hourly wages are €10,- ex. taxes First I will make a few sketches to your specifications, about 6 sketches will take 2 hours, so you can decide what kind of design you'd like or if you'd like to see more sketches. As soon as you pick a design I will customize it until you're satisfied, how that long will take depends on you (plural). From a sketch to a coloured vector (which can be resized to any size) takes about 4 hours x 12. With the cost are also commercial rights, I only retain the right to include the illustrations in my portfolio. - Kind regards, E. Palli (my real name, I use my real and artist name interchangeably)" Second e-mail, with this sketch attached. I sized it down. I told them I can do 6 sketches in 2 hours, they ask for 10 in 3, I comply. "Hello X, Hey E. I've discussed it with my boss and we'd like to get about 10 sketches (3 hours of work) of different kinds of frogs. One illustration we can picture is a frog in a circle, met a happy smile. He's wearing a sleeveless shirt which reads "FF" across his chest in white letters. The plan was that I was going to do the sketches myself, but I think this will cost me too much time, which is why I went looking for an illustrator. I've included the first sketches, so you know what direction we want to take. Once we've received the 10 sketches, we'll see how it goes. We'll have to think of the poses we want. Kind regards, X" I send them these sketches a week later to help them nail down the design they want. "Without shirt, it will be added later. Small: [link] Large: [link] Did you have an address I can bill? Kind regards, Thaily" Get an e-mail a week later, but there's been no mention of a deadline or anything, so I'm not too bothered. "Hey Thaily, I only work Tuesdays at Tenno Media at the moment (the company you drew for). My boss is going to look at the sketches one of these days and as soon as I hear back about it I'll contact you again. You can send your bill to Tenno Media. [blanked address] I really like your sketches, nice style! Greetings, X" Listen to me smalltalk, yap yap. "Hey X, Thank you, I hope your noss (typo) likes them too :P - Kind regards, Thaily" While I asked for a billing address, I hadn't billed them for the first batch of sketches yet. Keep in mind; 10 sketches, 3 hours of work, €10,- an hour = €30,- so far. "Hey Thaily, We had a little meeting and we'd like to see another ten sketches. Some comments: The head can be fairly human, like the middle frog (touching his upper arm). The body can be broader and more muscular. This will be another 3 hours of work. Furthermore we'd like to see sketches of Ferdie: 1 holding weights. 2 spinning on a bike. 3 running on a treadmill 4 flexing his muscles 5 holding a sign 6 pointing left or right 7 in a round logo, like in my sample sketch. Because of my internship I stop working at Tenno Media after next week. You can mail the sketches to my boss at [email protected] en/or [email protected]. The contact will be via Peter. He is my boss. Ferdie will be the mascot of FitnessFerdie.nl. The web shop for it is being perfected and is temporarily placed at this url: [obsolete link]. Maybe the site's lay-out will help you with your sketches. Have a nice and greetings, X" I take a little over a week to respond this time because I suddenly got slammed with unexpected work; friend told me at the last minute he had gotten me an art panel at a convention, so I suddenly had 3 days to prepare for an art show. Augh. "Hey Thaily, How's the frog coming? :) Greetings, X" I managed my art show, then did the second batch of sketches and sent them to both the intern and Peter, the intern's boss whom was now my contact. I explain, for a second time (first being in my first e-mail to them) that they need to settle on a design before I can start on the final illustrations. I've even made it easier for them by putting all the sketches on the same sheet and lettering and numbering the heads and bodies so they can just tell me which body and head they like best so we can combine them and move things along. "Hey X and Peter, Sorry for the delay, I was told at the very last moment that there was an art panel reserved for me at an art show. Here's the second batch of 10 sketches; I added numbers and letters so you can easily indicate which combination of heads&bodies you like, as soon as we decide on a design I can start on the sketches for the illustrations. Small: [link] Large: [link] - Kind regards, Thaily" At this point I decide I'd like to get paid before we go any further, so I send Peter the bill for 20 sketches; 6 hours of work is €60,-, plus taxes the total came to €70,80. Again I remind people this is essentially minimum wage, this will be hilariously relevant in a moment. "Dear Mr Bierhuizen, Here is my bill for the 20 sketches. - Kind regards, Thaily [I attached the 2 specified bills as PDFs, they are from Gear-IT.nl which is my husband's company, because it was easier at the time]" Here's where it took a sudden and sharp turn downhill; the intern gone I was left to deal with Peter who (perhaps after being faced with a bill and the realization that yes, I expect to be paid for my time) suddenly felt all my work was unsatisfactory and unusable. He says he's looking for a specific type of frog, but despite being prompted to tell me which design comes closest to what he wants, he decides he wants to back out of the deal without paying me for the work he has already commissioned and has already been provided. "Dear Thaily, I have looked at the sketches and I'm missing that which X asked for. X gave a whole list with situations and positions that we wanted to see sketches. However I don't see any of these positions. So I can't do anything with your sketches. To be honest I couldn't do anything with the first batch of sketches because I asked for (at least X) what I wanted. So I'm not very happy because you're sending me 2 bills for things I can essentially do nothing with. I'm looking for a particular type frog (see the list of X further down in the mail (was the same list translated further up)) depicted in a number of fitness related poses but I have received none of this. So I'm going to stop because I'm not sure this collaboration is going to be successful. I hope to have informed you sufficiently. Kind regards, P. Bierhuizen Tenno Media]" Assuming the best, that he is merely confused, I explain for a third time that he has to pick a design before I can do the illustrations from the list. I don't wanna do 12 sketches only to have him change his mind about the design before I can finalize. Plus it would cost more, I'm trying to save him money. "Dear Mr Bierhuizen, The sketches are to determine the design of the character, once the design is to your liking (the customer picks a design they like or a combination of designs they like) I will finish the sketches; the 12 sketches of the character on a bicycle/with weights etc. so all the illustrations will be to your liking and consistent. I have only billed you for the 20 sketches at the price we agreed upon beforehand. - Kind regards, Thaily" TL:DR, Peter still fails to understand simple things. 2 notes about that. 1. I was completely bewildered by his failure to understand this simple procedure. First you decide what the mascot looks like before I draw the mascot doing various things. It's not rocket science. And I know it's not me because I've designed numerous characters for various people, if anything people are excited when given choices and the chance to customize the character to suit their personal tastes. I've never had problems with anyone in this matter. 2. He says that if he makes me do the sketches he'll have a spent a fortune before he has anything that looks anything like something he can use; in addition to the procedure I gave him my time estimates and hourly rates beforehand. This only became a problem the moment he actually had to pay for completed work. Allow me to iterate; a fortune. Literally, he uses those words; "Een vermogen". Minimum wage. Aw yeah, I be ballin' with my €10 an hour! "It clearly describes what X wanted to see. I'm sorry but I think your work method is kind of too vague. If I let you make the sketches I'll lose a fortune before I see anything that looks anything like what I want. I don't think that can be the plan. If you included what I wanted to see a la, but this isn't the intention." As a side note I should indicate that he dropped all civilized pretense, as well as his ability to capitalize, punctuate and spell (I'm fixing this in the translation for legibility's sake), giving the impression he can't be bothered with it anymore. I know how he feels, so I give him an ultimatum, pay or lose any claim to the work. "We can do 2 things: - You pay me and you can use the sketches and designs, if anything to give to another designer to finalize the work. - You don't pay and I will sell the designs to a third part to compensate for my financial damages and you cannot use the sketches; so you can't pass them on to another designer without infringing on my copyright." He takes a few days to respond. "go ahead and sell them. i can't use them and will never use them" So, he had all my info ahead of time, knew what he was getting into and is not backing out of payment for work he commissioned and has already been completed; breach of contract. I inform him I will be letting my colleagues (hi guys!) know about him since you know.. Whether or not I manage to mitigate my financial damage, he's still breaking his contract and likely to do it to the next person as well. "Okay, I'll my colleagues know that you break your contracts. Good luck (with your future endeavors)!" This, perhaps predictably, leads to further deterioration in his ability to communicate like a professional. "My god, you are such a vengeful type. I'll tell your colleagues that you (read Gear IT) simply don't deliver what is asked for and that YOU are really (and easily provable) not delivering on your obligations. THAT my dear is actually the real problem. I ask A but get B. Think about that and stop (zeiken, crude Dutch for taking a piss; bitching, moaning, whining, carrying on etc.) pissing on about it, toddler" I iterate, Gear IT is my husband's IT company, we just sent the bill under that name because it was more convenient at the time; I didn't have a PDF and was too busy to make one, but the bill was specified and obviously from me, this is was not in dispute (just that he had to pay it). I correct him since well, Hiryu doesn't do illustration and design, he does hosting (sites, Minecraft servers etc.), security, domain registration and so forth. So if he wants to complain about the right person (i.e. probably lie his pants off) he should complain about Spirit Link Studio. "- Not Gear IT, Spirit Link Studio. - Be sure to present all your "evidence", k? :D" Further breakdown in communication and him not understanding simple things. "So why do you send bills with Gear IT on it. I added it just in case you forgot. Fucking (fokkin = Dutch white trash way of saying "fucking") vague as far as I'm concerned. Read your mails there's enough evidence that you don't deliver on your promises. I've had enough of this stupid pissing on. I'm going to stop replying." I explain simple things with small words. "Because it was easier at the time. Good luck (with your future endeavors)! :D" True to his word, he has yet to reply. But it's only been a day or two and sometimes he takes a week to respond, so there might be more swindling man-child rage to update with later. So uh, in short; don't work for this guy. He only likes your designs until the first bill shows up, then things quickly deteriorate into ignorance, lies and cussing. In a related note, if anyone wants to buy a frog adoptable, I have some available here ? Edit: Thanks for the input guys! Yeah there might have been a miscommunication, the "customer" was vague and told me to draw another 10 sketches "kinda like X". Had he gone "Oh that's not what I meant, I meant Y." the miscommunication could have been dealt with in a civil and mature manner. It wouldn't have been a problem. Unfortunately he immediately broke the contract by pulling out without paying, not to mention the condescending attitude and crass language. I managed to stay civil even after he said he wasn't going to pay for my time, so I don't understand his outbursts at all. In years of doing commissions, he is only the second unhappy customer I've ever had, and it's due to his own lack of patience, understanding and basic manners. I'll probably stay away from similar contracts for the time being, because they cost more time and aggravation than they're worth (especially when you're not being paid) and if I do take a design contract, I'll make them pay part up front like with normal commissions. Lesson learned, I'm moving on to my paying customers ?

Sep. 7th, 2011 at 12:13 AM tijgerhuis This isn't a Beware as much as it is calling attention to blatant ignoring of a paying customer. Papaya's an amazing artist, don't get me wrong, and a really nice person. I'd just like this situation resolved, after six months of waiting, four months lacking of any communication whatsoever outside of short conversations at conventions, and recently, outright disregarding any messages at all. You guys have probably seen her around. http://furaffinity.net/user/papayafruitsushi I'd hate to give the wrong impression here. Again, all I'm hoping to do with this is bring attention to the situation, get some input, and get it resolved easily. Back in February, Papaya posted an FWA thread for badge commissions, and I jumped onboard right away (I'm Toraie). After the conversation there, I sent a PM through FA detailing the character, commission, etc., which was replied to promptly. I wasn't able to pay until the week after, and I let her know. After she claims here to have sketches, I go ahead and pay right away. FWA comes and goes, and I don't get a chance to talk to her, but having to deal with college and many other things, I don't get in touch again until right before ESG (bottom email), where I only hear from her that she's left all commissions back at home, and that she'd try to find them before too long. At this point, having waited a good three months since I paid, I barely want it anymore. Sometime in June (top email), I remind her through email, because she'd explicitly stated all contact was to be through email and not FA notes. No reply. And then it's time for Megaplex. I caught her for a few moments there, and Papaya told me it was in her room, and that she'd get it to me before I left. I left without hearing anything from her, though. A few days after that (per her journal saying she was busy and needed a few days), I send another email (bottom) giving a day that I'd like a reply by. I've already paid, so I really should be able to do this. No reply. The following week, another one (top email). Nothing. All I'm seeing are journals saying she'll be in touch with commissioners soon. And finally, I leave a shout on her page asking if she still uses that email for business. It's a fair question, but it got shoved off before it got replied to, and then others' commissions start getting posted. I can understand slowly working through commissions, but failing to answer simple questions like in my emails is unprofessional. I'd like to emphasize the absolute lack of communication here - surely, if you've got the time to post a commission, much less be working on it, you have the time to fire off a quick yes/no email. It's not about the money here, though I would like it back rather than having the commission finished. I'm just leaving a public notice here, because private communication sure isn't getting the job done.

WHO: FA user Battenburgcake [nsfw/adult account BloodSugar] WHERE: http://www.furaffinity.net/user/battenburgcake/ WHAT: 2 full digital pieces WHEN: Inital note, agreement and paid on April 8th 2011. First commission received May 20th. Second commission still not received, August 31st 2011. PROOF: Initial Commission offer: http://s1115.photobucket.com/albums/k549/NomOnMomo/?action=view&current=commission1.png Artist accepts commission: http://s1115.photobucket.com/albums/k549/NomOnMomo/?action=view&current=commission2-1.png Payment proof: http://s1115.photobucket.com/albums/k549/NomOnMomo/?action=view&current=paypal1.jpg First note send asking about commission status: http://s1115.photobucket.com/albums/k549/NomOnMomo/?action=view&current=commission3.png Note read by artist: http://s1115.photobucket.com/albums/k549/NomOnMomo/?action=view&current=commission4.jpg Other notes recently sent and no response: http://s1115.photobucket.com/albums/k549/NomOnMomo/?action=view&current=unreadnotes.jpg EXPLAIN: I commissioned Batten for two pieces, a one character and a two character, on Apr 8th, 2011, 11:02 AM. The total came out to $25 and I paid it via paypal in full on Apr 8th, 2011, 11:01 PM. I recieved my first commission May 20th and since then I have not gotten my second piece or heard from the artist after sending them notes to both accounts. I don't mind if it takes the artist a while to complete something, because I understand things happen outside of our control sometimes, so long as they let the commissioner know what's going on, or that it's going to take them some time/they will be unavailable etc. However, I haven't received a single note from them or a reply to notes I have sent them. Since it's past 45 days, I can't dispute it via paypal -_- Any advice? :s I know it's just $15 but that could have gone to a more responsible artist :S

Aug. 16th, 2011 at 2:27 PM undertow26 I'm not sure if I want to call this a beware. I feel bad putting her here because the transaction started out really awesome, but it declined from there. WHO: Neemeister neemeister.deviantart.com WHERE: Deviantart WHAT: $85 two character commission. WHEN: Beginning of May/June 2010 until now. PROOF: The exchange. She asked me about some details about the story and my characters, so my replies are omitted for personal reasons. [Censored by mod for lack of censoring. Paypal screencap is valid] EXPLAIN: I paid for a commission in June 2010 of two of my characters. In the beginning, the transaction went smoothly, but she required payment upfront. This was fine with me, I've done it before with good results. Since she was going through a tough situation I made the mistake of sending the full 85 USD to her account instead of half/half, which she said would be alright. Everything was fine, I was really excited about this commission. Almost three months go by and I don't get any progress. I understand that she had other commissions before mine so I wasn't really worried at this point. I sent her a message inquiring the status. Since she wasn't on dA very often. the exchange spanned from Aug 30th to Oct 1st. I omitted some unnecessary stuff, hope that's ok. The changes requested was for one of the characters who I redesigned. She went silent for a while, and closed her commissions in December. I was going to ask her about the commission again, but saw her reply to someone else's inquiry on her commission journal saying she intended to get to them. Reassured, I forgot about the commission. Until April/May of this year. I was a bit frustrated at this point. She stopped uploading to her dA gallery. It wasn't the time that got to me, it was the lack of communication. I sent a reply on her dA journal. And it was hidden. By now I'm getting bad vibes. I can understand hiding the comment but she didn't even reply. Irritated, I sent a note to another of her customers. I took out her screen name for privacy reasons. But it looks like I'm not the only one who hasn't received art from this artist. [Removed by mods for proxy] Doing a search on her screen name, I found some accounts on different websites, one that was last visited in July of this year. So I don't think she's out of internet. I sent her another note asking for the status of the commission and it sits unread in my inbox. I'm rather upset that I had to come here in the first place because this started off so promising. I don't want to assume the worst, but it appears that she's been recently active on other sites which isn't a good sign. I'm thinking of issuing a chargeback since I paid with a credit card, but I think too much time has allotted since the initial transaction. I will happily mark this as resolved if she gets in contact with me again, but right now it seems unlikely that I'll ever get the art. =/

Aug. 14th, 2011 at 8:18 PM thebrokentape WHO: Vaughnblondtail -> www.vaughnblondetail.deviantart.com, www.furaffinity.net/user/vaughnblondetail WHERE: Furaffinity.net/Deviantart.com WHAT: $75 commission from me WHEN: Initiated beginning of June 2011, finished June 24th PROOF: 1: http://i985.photobucket.com/albums/ae340/ABrokenCassette/Picture32.png 2: http://i985.photobucket.com/albums/ae340/ABrokenCassette/Picture33.png EXPLAIN: So this guy commissioned me to do a series of seven colored images for $75. As is my usual policy, I asked him to pay me half up front and then the second half when the piece was finished. He sent me the first half of the money without any problems, but then comes the trouble. After finally finishing the piece I told him that I had it ready, and if he was set to send me the second half of the money. He said he was, and so I sent him the image with a watermark. He said that he loved it, but then promptly told me that he didn't have the rest of his payment yet. ? I feel a little cheated and pretty frustrated because this guy also has decided to not respond to any of my attempts at communication (it's been a month and a half now with no word.) I've provided a few screencaps of conversations we had.

Edit: Got a DA account, sent her a note and gave her two page shouts... she ignored me. I can see she's responded to other people, and to one of them she said she wishes the trolls would shut up. >_< THIS IS A CONTINUATION OF: http://artists-beware.livejournal.com/390145.html#cutid1 WHO: Eclypse of FA / Leathurkatt on DA WHERE: http://leathurkatt.deviantart.com/ http://www.furaffinity.net/user/eclypse/ WHAT: A Celtic pawprint badge costing $15 and paid for with cash and in person. I had the understanding that it was traditional, but I don't have proof of that. WHEN: I paid for it in November of 2009. The last I heard from her until this summer was in September of 2010, saying she would finish the badge and also try to send me at least $10. Then, on June 23rd, 2011, she sent me the... "finished product" in an FA note. EXPLAIN: This started out as a situation involving an artist who was ridiculously flaky and bad at communication and never showed me any proof that she'd worked on my art. You can read about this part in the previous A_B entry about her. I had pretty much given up on her. Then she sent me the finished product in June 2011. It looked NOTHING like what I'd asked for. I wanted a paw with the colors magenta, purple, and blue and some Celtic hearts worked into the design. I also asked for a name and paid for a solid-color background. But I was just so sick of dealing with her that I didn't bother responding at all. A few weeks later, I looked at the image again and got suspicious. It appeared to be a recolor of another badge in her gallery, and the file name of mine had "cougar" in it. I looked at her commission queue and saw that another person had commissioned her for a cougar paw. I contacted this person, and it turns out the artist sent both of us the exact same image, which had been drawn for the other person's trade a year and a half ago. The image in Eclypse's gallery is a recolor of the paw she drew for the trade, not the other way around. I should have realized right away she was a liar. When she sent me the completed image, she claimed that she finished the artwork, then lost it, and thought she'd have to start over again. The file she "lost" had been created in January of 2010. Well, in September of 2010, she claimed that she had the lines done and just needed to finish it. The person who traded with Eclypse has been in contact with Eclypse on DA. I don't have the details of their conversation, but I know Eclypse has been extremely immature and rude. Eclypse claimed that she sent me the wrong image, then said what she did was completely acceptable, then blocked the person. I will let said person know about this A_B post, in case she wants to add anything to it. I myself have not been in touch with Eclypse. I sent her a note on FA saying, "Over a year and a half since I commissioned you, and still all I get is the same exact image you made for someone else. Wow." She has not read it. If she doesn't respond here, I'll have to resort to getting a DA account, because she is obviously active there. I have no interest in her art after this mess and plan to demand a refund. I don't want to get a DA account just to chase after her but that seems to be my option. PROOF: In this gallery I have screenshots of the paw she sent me, the traced paw from her gallery, key parts of our conversation, her price list, and her queue. http://pics.livejournal.com/paula_mino/gallery/00008qs8 I hope this is an okay way to share the images.

Jul. 30th, 2011 at 3:03 PM lackoflollies Edit of an Edit! She sent me.. $10.. when.. I paid her $6. ? I'm sending $4 back, I don't need extra money, and I refuse to take it. Edit: She sent me this very lovely note: http://i52.tinypic.com/14tuf7n.jpg Now this lovely LiveJournal entry: http://pics.livejournal.com/lackoflollies/pic/00003pcw My first REAL post, bear with me. Yes, I am AuroraBorealia. WHO: RainbowJokerHound / Dog-Bone WHERE: http://www.furaffinity.net/user/rainbowjokerhound/ http://www.furaffinity.net/user/dog-bone WHAT: 2 $3 icons when she was having some kind of offer, journal is here: http://www.furaffinity.net/journal/2120709/ It has been capped in case she deletes or modifies it. WHEN: It had been a month or two before I noticed trouble. I asked for updates, first she said her desktop computer or laptop was not working and she was unable to do digital art, but she had been submitting digital works while stating that. So, again I asked for updates after I presumed it was fixed, and she got VERY rude with me, stating I had to wait my turn just like everybody else. As of then, she has been continually submitting things digitally, and ignoring me when I asked for updates. NOW she's saying I never paid her. http://www.furaffinity.net/journal/2417369/ Edit: She saw my paypal screenshot and apologized for saying that, so that's situated. Everything else, however is still valid. This journal she says she owes me two icons, and my unanswered comment about updates. PROOF: http://i54.tinypic.com/r0v3o1.png Paypal transaction proving I sent the money for this. http://www.furaffinity.net/journal/2120709/ Journal EXPLAIN: I commissioned her in February because I had wanted some new icons, and noticed she was open. So I sent off my details via PM, and sent her the $6. I wanted for a month noticed she had completed every one else before me. I aske dher how my icons were coming once, and she said she was anable to do digital work because her computer was broken and she lost the files, I said alright and went on my merry way, I figured things would look up. A month or so later, maybe more, I notice she started submitting again, and when I asked for an update I got a nasty PM stating I needed to wait my turn just like every one else. Once I find the screenshot of this I will add it into the post. It is now July, and i've flat out asked for my money back. However, she is now stating I never paid her, which in the above screenshot, and based on the paypal in her journal, I totally did. This is the first time i've ever had issues with an artist, so I waited WAY too long to file a dispute, let alone properly save and record messages pertaining to this due to being a victim of FA leaks, I delete my PMs regularly, so i'm desperately searching for proof i DID get to add to this post. So, this is just a little beware to avoid this artist.

Jul. 19th, 2011 2:55 PM nathanial WHO dust-bite/Torrian Dear/EEEEAAGULLLL WHERE: dust-bite/Torrian Dear, EEEEAAGULLLL on Subeta WHAT: Waist-up couple piece WHEN: April 23rd-Present PROOF: I commissioned dust-bite on April 23rd. I didn't commission her through deviantart, but through Subeta, where she's known as EEEEAAGULLLL. Here is a link to her artshop and my post where I originally commissioned her. My friend and I commissioned her at around the same time; she commissioned her for a head-shot, where as I commissioned her for a $30 waist-up couple piece of my two characters. She got the sketches to both of us at around the same time, however she finished my friend's very quickly afterward whereas after I OKed the sketch and paid her... nothing. Here is a screencap of my payment. Here's the sketch: After about three weeks of no contact, and after she set up a chibi auction before finishing my piece, I sent her a PM on Subeta asking how things were going. Unfortunately Subeta didn't have a working outbox at the time, so I can't show the message I sent, but I assure you it was a very polite inquiry. In the mean time she was updating her DeviantArt quite frequently, and while it stated that she was moving, she still had the ability to respond to messages and post the odd sketch here and there. Wondering if she just wasn't checking Subeta, I sent her another polite message on DeviantArt on June 1st. Within a couple hours, she had read it, but didn't repsond (and still hasn't responded.) Since then she has actively been posting on both DeviantArt and her tumblr (dust-bite.tumblr.com). Some of them are old commissions, some of them are new. She even had time to draw a kiriban image for someone on DeviantArt, and work on her comic and website, orange-zombie.com. Getting a bit frustrated with the fact that she clearly had time to respond to my message/finish my art but chose not to, I decided to send her an e-mail on June 30th to the address she has listed on her DA page. Still polite, but I haven't received a response. At this point I just want my money back, but I don't know how to get ahold of her other than the methods I've tried already. She won't reply to my messages. I have a feeling she's purposefully ignoring me because it says on her commission journal (which I didn't see until after I sent her the first note on DA since I commissioned her on another site) that she will 'take longer if bugged.' "Please be patient when you commission me. Don't rush me, it will only make me go slower. Asking for updates is a little stressful, but I'll provide them." I didn't really think I was rushing her... I just want to know if she ever plans on finishing my art, and if not, if she can refund me. It's true that I haven't asked for a refund yet, before anyone mentions it, but I'm kind of a doormat and I'm afraid of doing it until she actually replies to me. I realize now I probably should have mentioned that in my e-mail. Unfortunately I can't dispute this, not only because it's been over 40 days but because when I sent the money I didn't realize you shouldn't send payment as gifts. Sweet.

Jul. 9th, 2011 at 4:27 PM vibris_sae I was told last time that it was time to make an official beware post, but the artist in question contacted me in the comments, apologized, and said the art would be done at the end of June. I think it's time, though, since it's been nine months of excuses and being ignored, and I really don't want anyone else taken in for more money than I spent. :T I commissioned Rabid Sept. 15, 2010 for three digital busts to be finished by Halloween at $15. After Halloween passed with no sign of them I poked her, and was told since I wasn't first in the queue she didn't get to mine. I said fine, just finish them whenever. I waited until Jan. 17 of '11 to ask her again. She was nice about it, saying I didn't deserve to wait so long, she'd get them done. By this time the person I'd commissioned this for were no longer together, so I made a change and waited until mid-February, when I decided I'd ask what was up. She claimed she just forgot to do them, so I asked for a refund. I made sure to be extremely polite throughout this whole ordeal. She said she would as soon as she opened commissions again - which she did shortly afterward. After I threatened a Paypal dispute (I had no idea at this point of the time limit :P) she begged me not to, since she was using her grandma's PP. This back and forth went on for awhile until she stopped responding altogether. When I posted here to see if anyone had heard from her (and several had) she responded with more apologies and a promise to do the art - not to refund me as I'd asked and as she'd promised. Also in the comments section she admitted having traced over a photo for at least one submission. I have plenty of screencaps once again, if anyone needs proof. Maybe I was bothering her too much over $15 but it's still stealing. I've been contacted by at least one other person who was wondering if she'd done the art I'd commissioned, which I thought was kind of bad form - but it's relevant that other people are being screwed over too. At this point I don't expect to see either a refund or the art, and I'm giving up trying to pursue it. It seems like she'd rather placate people or ignore them rather than fulfill her obligations. ? Edited: Caps: Inital deadline: http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v40/paris_in_flames/Capture5.png Offered refund: http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v40/paris_in_flames/Capture4.png Art offered after refund never shows up: http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v40/paris_in_flames/Capture3.png Art promised in June: http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v40/paris_in_flames/Capture2.png Proof of tracing: http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v40/paris_in_flames/Capture-2.png