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  • Beware: Lemonbrat


    camarofurry
    • Who: Artist
      Where: http://www.lemonbrat.com
      When: 12/12/2018
      What: Fursuit/ Fursuit Parts

      Resolved
    Celestina

    Update 08.01.19, 10pm central:  Lemonbrat's response can be found here.

    Update 08.03.19, a "pending resolution" tag has been added as the suit is en route to the client.

    Update 08.03.19, 10:30pm central:  Images of the repaired suit have been added.

    Update 08.09.19, this has been marked as resolved.

    Message added by Celestina

    Celestina

    Howdy Twitter!

    Before commenting please review our Code of Conduct.  All comments are moderated, meaning they are manually approved.

    08.09.19:  Comments have been reopened given there are some concerns.  Our members more experienced in suits please feel free to leave insight.

    Message added by Celestina

    Situation:   I ordered a custom suit from Lemonbrat in late 2018.   With the understanding that the suit would be paid off 3 months prior to July, as I needed to suit to be finished and shipped in time for Eurofurence (leaving 12 August 2019).   The terms of service changed somewhere in Febuary or March when I actually paid off the suit.

    Initial Deposit:  https://images2.imgbox.com/3f/d1/LIZAfgSE_o.jpg

    Final Payment: https://images2.imgbox.com/89/8c/s9pQ3s2C_o.png

    Assurances on Finish Time: https://images2.imgbox.com/2a/50/9gHwLCC3_o.png

     

    They changed the refund policy from (cost of materials and labour will be taken from refund, and at our descretion) to (no payments are refundable)

    They changed there creation time from 2-3 months after complete payment, to 3-4 months for people who pay upfront.   They also changed the deposit terms.

    I can't remember what the original percentage was, but it changed to 100% payment before construction. 

    The person dealing with my suit told me that I was bound to the old TOS since I paid off the suit before the changes were made.

     

    From the time of being paid off I have had nothing but issues.    Communication was extremely bad right from the start.  I had to go out of my way to contact them every week or two to get any information.    The suit was supposed to have started construction 3 months prior to July, and didn't start construction until the last few days of June.  Giving them around 30 days to start a suit, a suit I had assumed they had already started.   That was a shock.  

    Image:  Re-confirming a July finish:  https://images2.imgbox.com/b9/d3/qhIVTi77_o.jpg

    I didn't recieve any progress update images until mid-july, the date the suit was supposed to ship.   twice after that, I got assurances the suit would be finished and shipped by the 'end of the week', twice I was told this, and twice the deadline was missed, making three missed deadlines.

    My fursuit head was made into a mouse head, it had to be completely redone.

    head1.JPG

    head9.jpg

    head8.jpg

    head2.JPG

    old head.jpg

    My tail was made short and curly, and I was told that it was exactly the same as my reference image. 

    When I pointed out that it wasnt - and therefore not what I asked for, they said, "Oh, but this is right for your suit - trust us."

    tailmsg.JPG

    tailmsg2.JPG

     

    I pressed again, that it was not what I asked for an they eventually redid it.    To my horror, they had made it supersized to the point that it would need carried.

    teamofpeople.JPG

    Even though I asked them to keep it long and skinny, and anotomically correct. 

     

    Several extras have been added to the suit (against my wishes) to try and compensate me because they realised they messed up.

    They added airbrushing, they're bumping up the shipping to Express International, and now they made a oversized tail (something I didn't pay for or want)

    They're completely designing the suit they way the *think* it should look and not what I asked for, and its more than just a "style" thing.

    Tail (first attempt)  https://images2.imgbox.com/90/17/Pa3F9l6Q_o.jpg

    Tail (second attempt)  https://images2.imgbox.com/84/2c/iYrvQ5KF_o.jpg

    Fursuit references: https://images2.imgbox.com/e1/13/sFGrxjpO_o.jpg

    https://images2.imgbox.com/5c/b1/GSVYWuhI_o.jpg

    https://images2.imgbox.com/03/ea/izTVbu2S_o.png

    1 out of 4 fursuit reference that was sent has not been posted here due to it being NSFW

     

    I get the feeling the person dealing with my suit is new.   By his own admission,  he had to pass on the fursuit head to a head artist to have it completely redone.

    They also said that a whole team is working on my suit to try and get it done on time, this is not a good sign.

    I have over 40 emails from Lemonbrat from my back and forths with them since December of 2018.   I've uploaded some of those emails but seeing as there are so many, I'm gonna limit what I've uploaded, if anyone needs anything specific will be happy to add it later.

     

    Other images: https://images2.imgbox.com/3c/16/AoO5elCV_o.jpg (Tail argument)

    https://images2.imgbox.com/05/52/5NevIVAT_o.jpg (Tail argument)

     

    Other proof:

    depconstruct.JPG

    target.png

     

    Update:  They've sent pictures of the suit.

    DSC_0761.jpg.3d7180b53beb0c95582302800ce88a23.jpg

    DSC_0763.jpg

    snip.png

    Update:  08.03.19

    The suit has been repaired, and is now en route to the client.  The email confirming shipping is being withheld to protect the client's privacy. 

    camaro-183.jpg

    camaro-203.jpg

    camaro-205.jpg

    camaro-207.jpg

    Update: 08.09.19

    Hi there, quick update.

    The suit arrived, with the ears fixed.   Not sure how they did it, as I assumed they weren't going to.

    The suit is snug and fits neatly, and although I am excited and happy to have it there were a few issues:

     

    Minor Issues:

    - No care instructions

    -No instructions on how to fit cushions into the digigrade legs properly or how to put on.

    (a lot of trial and error to get it right)

    Serious Issues:

    -The suit arrived with fur stuck in the zipper, and the zip had been driven over and beyond the jam

    (I managed to fix it with some gentle tugging to release the fur from the middle of the zip but it was really worrying)

    -The zip is extremely tempromental and sticks.  It requires two people to suit up and out.  Almost got stuck inside trying it on (wanted to make sure it fit because of the issues previous)

    -The tail is detachable, and attaches with a belt loop on the rear of the suit.  (this is something that kind of gripes me as it breaks the magic, but there's not much I can do about it.   They claim it was the 'only' way to fix the horrible bulge they had on the rear of the suit, and it's still there, it's just less noticeable. 

    Other points

    -They included the repairs with the cost of fixing there mistakes.   I asked them to put the value of the materials only on the customs form for cheaper import fees.   They bumped the price up to 600$ I suspect they included the price of used materials for the repairs to their own mistakes, I didn't like this, but I shrugged it off, as I didn't want to argue with them anymore.

    (A few friends have expressed that they feel the price is a bit hefty but I have no knowledge of these things so please don't take my word as fact here)

    Overall, I'm happy with the suit, I still have a few gripes about it, and clearly it was a fight to get it "this good" and it's still not perfect.   I'm not trying to be a 'nightmare' customer, I just expect professionalism from a "big name" in the fursuit making community.   A suit arriving with fur jammed, and run over with a zipper, no care instructions, and no instructions on how to actually use the "large cushions" they provided to pad out the legs is a little sloppy in my oppinoun.

    And then there's the issues that was listed on my beware previously.  I feel they only went so far with there repairs to save their own reputation, had I not made the beware and kept pressure on them to fix the mistakes I don't know what the suit would look like, they initially refused outright to do any further repairs after the head recarve.

    If they did bump up the price of the material cost, simply for shipping purposes as a payback for all the repairs they did, I find that a little petty. 

    All in all, I've decided not to go to Lemonbrat for anything again, and a lot of people have given me there support on this without asking, saying they won't even buy things from there stalls anymore.

    I appreciate all the support the AB team and the people who read my posts and twitter have given me.   And if you chose not support Lemonbrat, that is your choice, but I wouldn't blame you.

     

    All the best,

    Camaro.



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    Completed suit, 3600$+
    A premium suit from a premium maker, this is unacceptable!

    DSC_0761.jpg

    Edited by camarofurry

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    First, the no refund policy absolutely doesn't hold up and them trying to enforce that is ridiculous.

    Secondly, that is clearly a rodent head. I can't believe they were actually doubling down that the rodent head would magically look like a cat head once furred. I don't see that working at all, the muzzle and cheeks are the wrong shape and the ears are very round. There's a reason foam bases are used and it's because they affect what the final shape looks like. Just a really weird beware 

    As for the tail, curved tails like that are often made so they don't drag on the ground, most fursuits have curved tails like that regardless of the character unless they're floor draggers. It keeps them from getting dirty. 

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    That finalized suit is absolutely unacceptable. First timers can do better than that. W O W.

    This is ignoring everything else about the interaction. I would want a refund. Ridiculous. I am so angry for you.

    Also, I just wanted to speak out that unasked for "enhancements" as compensation without prior warning are also unappreciated. I got some gunk on the inside of a fursuit head of mine, sent it back to the maker in hopes they could clean it out / fix it, and instead they thought they'd be nice and completely redo the head.... the outside of the head... The looks and expression all changed. So much wasted effort. I didn't like it after that and I sold it afterwards. So I feel you on how these nice efforts just make things worse.

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    1 hour ago, camarofurry said:

    Completed suit, 3600$+
    A premium suit from a premium maker, this is unacceptable!

    DSC_0761.jpg

    This is pretty bad quality. Is that even faux fur? It looks like minky fabric which I....don't think I've seen a suit made with before. It looks so wrinkly, they didnt even attempt to make the zipper discrete, the tail looks slapped on, the whole thing is so low quality for the price tag paid, they should have the experience to know better. Have they sent photos of the finished head from the front? I'd be curious to see how that came out with them pushing a rodent base. 

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    I see they haven't sent a pic of the front of the suit, only the back..and with the way the back looks....I'm a bit worried.

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    1 minute ago, Bourbon said:

    This is pretty bad quality. Is that even faux fur? It looks like minky fabric which I....don't think I've seen a suit made with before. It looks so wrinkly, they didnt even attempt to make the zipper discrete, the tail looks slapped on, the whole thing is so low quality for the price tag paid, they should have the experience to know better. Have they sent photos of the finished head from the front? I'd be curious to see how that came out with them pushing a rodent base. 

    It's short tipped fur, so all the wrinkles will show in it.  IMO if OP didn't specifically ask for this fur, the builder should have avoided it or said something.  Goodness.

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    5 minutes ago, Celestina said:

    It's short tipped fur, so all the wrinkles will show in it.  IMO if OP didn't specifically ask for this fur, the builder should have avoided it or said something.  Goodness.

    Thank you for the explanation! I don't see how/why they would have chosen this style of fur instead of just shaving down faux fur like most suits. It looks appalling. 

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    Find it strange they haven't sent you a photo of the front and the fur is not made for full body suit. I have tried a similiar fur which ended up SUPER heavy and wrinkly while the face on the fuirsuit head looked decent.

    Also the ears looks like two diffrent sizes and I dont understand why they think a tail to a cougar looks like a canines tail and in their gallery they have patterns for a long feline tail.

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    Seeing the back makes me dread what it looks like from the front. It does not look like a suit you would normally get for that price.

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    14 minutes ago, Fawk said:

    Seeing the back makes me dread what it looks like from the front. It does not look like a suit you would normally get for that price.

    Found the front view twitter and is it just me or is the muzzle crooked

     

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    36 minutes ago, Sivi said:

    Found the front view twitter and is it just me or is the muzzle crooked

     

    The profile still looks like a rodent head, this is truly appalling. And the thing is that the suits on their site are decent, you'd expect so much higher quality than what this commissioner received. I can't get over how badly attached the tail is. 

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    Not only that, but the fur on the bridge of the nose looks wrinkled. There's not even a joint there to create wrinkles.

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    1 hour ago, Bourbon said:

    The profile still looks like a rodent head, this is truly appalling. And the thing is that the suits on their site are decent, you'd expect so much higher quality than what this commissioner received. I can't get over how badly attached the tail is. 

    Looking at the previeus felines they done they have clearly a pattern for long tails that would be perfect for cougars and far more cat like heads. I am starting to feel this whole suit is rushed.

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    Camaro is currently sending us more emails to update this post, but I did want to drop in and just leave my opinion.

    Like I know this fur is naturally really wrinkly and hard to hide seams in, but they should have been up front this would be an issue.  And that doesn't even account for the fact that the profile still looks rodent like.  Plus there's this strange overlap of the light fur on the upper eyebrows that hide the actual eyebrows.  I'm not sure what's going on there, but once you see it it's hard to unsee it.

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    36 minutes ago, Celestina said:

    Camaro is currently sending us more emails to update this post, but I did want to drop in and just leave my opinion.

    Like I know this fur is naturally really wrinkly and hard to hide seams in, but they should have been up front this would be an issue.  And that doesn't even account for the fact that the profile still looks rodent like.  Plus there's this strange overlap of the light fur on the upper eyebrows that hide the actual eyebrows.  I'm not sure what's going on there, but once you see it it's hard to unsee it.

    Dont forget the very uneven nose and two diffrent sized ears.

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    I misread the messages and was thinking "Well yeah thats a VERY good rodent base I wonder what the problem is" then I realized that somehow it was supposed to be a cat...wtf. As someone who's seen their fursuits in person at furcon this is CLEARLY not even close to the quality they're able to put out.

    my partner was considering purchasing one of their premades last furcon and was going to check out their booth with me this year if they had one again. I'll let them know to not give them any business and look elsewhere.

    The quality is absolutely appalling and you deserve much better. I wish you the best of luck at getting the money back or what you paid for. Though I'd assume a person would prefer their money back so they could pay someone who actually knows what they're doing and respects their customers instead.

    thanks for taking the time to post this beware

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    So I've gotten a suit from Lemonbrat and they have been nothing but kind and courteous and prompt with their responses. 

    This to me looks like buyer's remorse. The images you provided make it seem like you were contacted in March about your due date and work had started on the suit in June. Which you received wips for. Where are the rest of the emails from them? In order to clear the air I would provide them.

    Tmk Lemonbrat doesn't make changes unless it's requested by the customer. They send wip pictures and you need to approve them before more work is done on the suit.

    They have their customers choose the fur colors, they even send swatches. So that's on you. The fur looks like short pile fur, maybe sable or seal, it wrinkles. It's gonna happen with shorter furs. You're going to see seams unless you're using lux or another long pile fur. 

    Lemonbrat has a team of people who work on these suits, I have met several of them and they're always super friendly. You sound like an awful customer.

    You provided a ref from the lion king first off.  You need consistent reference images. Looking at the main one the tail is curved. Have you seen a big cat like a panther? Their tails naturally have a curve so they don't drag on the ground.

    I don't see the airbrushing you speak of, to be fair I see absolutely nothing that would suggest it was airbrushed at all. It all looks like fur and shadows of fur in the images. 

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    51 minutes ago, Kiarra said:

    Tmk Lemonbrat doesn't make changes unless it's requested by the customer.

    The client did request changes.  Lemonbrat tried to talk them out of it as clearly shown. 

    Quote

    They have their customers choose the fur colors, they even send swatches. So that's on you. The fur looks like short pile fur, maybe sable or seal, it wrinkles. It's gonna happen with shorter furs. You're going to see seams unless you're using lux or another long pile fur. 

    Not all customers understand how furs behave.  The onus is on Lemonbrat to ensure that they know this will be an issue.

    This still doesn't excuse the crooked nose, issues with the upper eyes, the ugly tail attachment, the ears being different sizes, and the head still looking like a rodent.

    It's fine if you've had a good experience with this builder and want to share,  and it's fine to want to defend your friends/ people you know.  However, accusing the OP of being "a terrible customer" for being rightfully upset toes the line, and I'm going to ask that you tone it down if you want to continue participating here.

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    23 hours ago, Bourbon said:

    First, the no refund policy absolutely doesn't hold up and them trying to enforce that is ridiculous.

    Secondly, that is clearly a rodent head. I can't believe they were actually doubling down that the rodent head would magically look like a cat head once furred. I don't see that working at all, the muzzle and cheeks are the wrong shape and the ears are very round. There's a reason foam bases are used and it's because they affect what the final shape looks like. Just a really weird beware 

    As for the tail, curved tails like that are often made so they don't drag on the ground, most fursuits have curved tails like that regardless of the character unless they're floor draggers. It keeps them from getting dirty. 

    This. The head would never look like a cat's. Wrong anatomy and proportions, the nose isn't even close? I don't know why they would use that and then say it would work out?

    As for the tail, you hit the nail on the head, but since they have not said it like that? Sounds more like they made mistakes and don't want to admit that.

    Either way, no refunds. No go and illegal.

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    This item has been upgraded from a Caution to a Beware given the suit's construction flaws and the fact that it is unlikely to meet deadline.  Currently, there are three emails in queue to be added to the post, but we are waiting on Camaro to supply a few more concerning the DTD and the fur selection.

    Please note: Users do not have the ability to edit their own posts, so we're doing our best to keep it updated.

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    1 hour ago, Kiarra said:

    So I've gotten a suit from Lemonbrat and they have been nothing but kind and courteous and prompt with their responses. [....]

    Your positive experience does not negate Camaro's negative experience. If Lemonbrat thoguht the time line provided at the time of commission was too rushed, or that they would be unable to provide a quality product to camaro for any reason, then the onus is on lemonbrat to cancel the commission.

    Lemonbrat clearly did not think that at any time and proceeded with the fursuit, delivering something that, regardless of the customer service issues, is extremely below the quality normally output from lemonbrat.

    This caution/beware is well deserved, and I hope lemonbrat steps up and makes this right by camaro.

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    4 hours ago, Celestina said:

    Camaro is currently sending us more emails to update this post, but I did want to drop in and just leave my opinion.

    Like I know this fur is naturally really wrinkly and hard to hide seams in, but they should have been up front this would be an issue.  And that doesn't even account for the fact that the profile still looks rodent like.  Plus there's this strange overlap of the light fur on the upper eyebrows that hide the actual eyebrows.  I'm not sure what's going on there, but once you see it it's hard to unsee it.

    Oh god, I just saw that. How could that happen even? I wouldn't know how you'd get wrinkles anywhere on the head.

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    A comment has been removed due to a violation of the Community Guidelines and Code of Conduct. A comment may be removed for one or more violations. If after reading the guidelines and code of conduct you feel this message was in error, please contact One (1) staff member.

    Rule in violation: Rule 5

    I am a Bot. My inbox is not monitored. Beep boop.

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    So,

    first off, you filed this artist beware dating it 12/12/2018 however your first payment was in december of 2018? you state it was late 2018 that the problems occured, however its only recently that problems have developed

    second, you have started a gofund me prior to resolving it with the seller. 

    third you understand do to the lion king ref you have to modify the suit due to copyright.

    fourth short pile fur is gunna show everything, and depending on body size and type its fitted as close to you as possible.

    fifth you are crying foul and rallying people to a cause because you are not happy trying to get a refund and gofund me is a double standard. according to your monthly payments it seems like you had to take time to pay for it then have it rushed for a international con???

    sixth before acting like an entitled and expect VIP treatment it seems theyve done theyre best to accommodate you and work with you.

    7th the cost of materials has risen so high do to the US's current trade tarrifs that materials ezpecially synth furs are 15-25% higher so its obvious sellers will adjust and protect themselves both in TOS and cost.

    ALSO i feel like you are not divulging all the information regarding this issue?

     

     

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    2 minutes ago, carbide said:

    So,

    first off, you filed this artist beware dating it 12/12/2018 however your first payment was in december of 2018? you state it was late 2018 that the problems occured, however its only recently that problems have developed

    Hiya!

    The "when" form on our submission form instructs individuals to state when the transaction started, not when issues started.  The actual submission date is timestamped on the post.

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